Apple Gestapo: How Apple Hunts Down Leaks

http://gizmodo.com/5427058/apple-gestapo-how-apple-hunts-down-leaks

by colinplamondon • 17 years ago

60 63 17 years ago

tptacek18• 17 years ago

I'm pretty sure people are in fact allowed to bring cameras onto the Apple campus, and, from what I can tell, there are no metal detectors or bag searches of any sort there. My knowledge is secondhand, but I'm inclined to believe that much of this article is BS.

quilby• 17 years ago

In Israel, because there is a fear from terrorists, before you go into any shop, restaurant, mall, or university, your bag is searched (for ~30 seconds) and sometimes a metal detector is used (a hand-held one). I know nothing about Apple HQ, but it would be trivial to set something like this up.

Unrelated, but they (Gizmodo) shouldn't have used the word 'gestapo' or anything else related to nazis.

selven• 17 years ago

And it's not just one off-handed comparison - the article goes on and on about it. It really trivializes the hardships of people who couldn't just leave and get another job, and where the stakes involved torture and death.

cmelbye• 17 years ago

I remember seeing a photo of an iPhone developer in front of a huge banner with a screenshot of his app inside of an Apple building on their campus, and it was labeled something like "Secret photo of me in front of banner with our app!" or something of that nature, so it's a possibility that they have restrictions on cameras.

antonovka23• 17 years ago

They have a restriction on taking pictures of things you shouldn't (which includes most of the campus), but they don't have restrictions on cameras.

In addition to there being no written rule against it, I've openly and regularly hauled digital video and still cameras across campus without ever hearing any complaint from the omnipresent security guards.

How do you think people work on iPhoto/iMovie/FCP? Check out cameras from a locked facility?

ugh• 17 years ago

Those Nazi comparisons sure are so funny.

makmanalp2• 17 years ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law

makmanalp2• 17 years ago

I don't know how people who work in large companies expect to have privacy on the company premises anyway: most of those companies make you sign a set of rules that basically says you forfeit your rights. Same concept in the military, you don't have a right to privacy because (they say) it would be to difficult to manage privacy and check for spies at the same time.

wheels7• 17 years ago

In more sane countries, they expect to have privacy because there are reasonable worker protection laws. Something of this sort would be illegal in most western countries.

As an American that's been in Germany for the last 8 years, it often blows my mind what's actually taken for granted as being acceptable in the US. Searching through employees' mail is illegal here (as would be searching an employee's personal belongings, drug tests, the whole shebang).

tptacek18• 17 years ago

How is it "sane" for companies not to be able to control and monitor their own Internet connections? People clearly do abuse those connections to violate IP, confidentiality, and insider trading agreements.

houseabsolute3• 17 years ago

A possible answer to the question: "Why wasn't Apple founded in Germany?"

houseabsolute3• 17 years ago

Sweet . . . I wish I worked on something so important that the secret police would interrogate me about it.

ghshephard• 17 years ago

I read through the article and thought that pretty much all the activity taken by the Apple Security team sounded reasonable. If I'm not mistaken, everything described was taking place in the work place/work systems/etc...

The sketchy companies go a little further, and start doing this with people's _personal_ lives. I'm thinking about when Patricia Dunn (HP Chairman) hired a private investigator to start hacking into people's Cell Phone Bills to find out who they were talking to - Not just from the office, or on office equipment.

There is a reason why you see so many Silicon Valley people carrying two laptops, two cellphones, etc... - One of them is for work, and is to be used in the workplace, and is handed over / searched / subject to surveillance / carries confidential company material. The other one is for personal stuff.

If there was a material leak from my organization, and it was jeopardizing my livelihood, I would darn well _hope_ company security would have its act together and would track down the leak in a professional manner.

tptacek18• 17 years ago

A reminder: Dunn was charged with felonies for that stunt.

elai• 17 years ago

Wouldn't you have to relinquish your personal laptop/cellphone is such situations too?

tptacek18• 17 years ago

If you bring your personal laptop into a high-security area and refuse to submit to a search, then, without calling the police, and unless grellas shows up to school me because I am not a lawyer, all your employer can do is fire you.

geekles• 17 years ago

This sounds like due diligence to protect shareholder interests.

"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place." - overheard in an interview somewhere.

dotBen• 17 years ago

And don't forget, most employees are APPL shareholders - so for them it's worth supporting rather than pushing back upon.

sown2• 17 years ago

And if I'm not a criminal, I shouldn't be treated as such.

It's a tad selfish, if you don't mind me saying, of you to automatically assume it's OK to give away my rights in addition to yours.

antonovka23• 17 years ago

This is Apple, not the Government. If you don't like the legal terms of employment, California is an at-will state. Quit.

That said, this article is total ridiculous bunk. Gizmodo has been trolled.

jrockway7• 17 years ago

How long until someone needs medical attention during one of these lockdowns, and they are fired for leaving to go to the doctor, or feel that they must endure the problem (and risk complications) in order to keep their job?

Not long, I bet, and I imagine that this practice will remain legal for ... oh ... about 3 months after that first case.

I hope Apple increases the frequency of this practice so that it attracts the attention of legislators sooner, and so that their brightest employees seek employment elsewhere. The beginning of the end is near.

tptacek18• 17 years ago

I think it's pretty ridiculous to imply that Apple would accept spectacular corporate liability by dissuading someone from seeking emergency medical attention during an IT investigation. So my guess as to the answer to your question is: it will never happen.

Apple's brightest employees (on the high-security projects) have been aware of extreme security measures for many years now, and positions on those teams are sought after.

DenisM• 17 years ago

The reason why they need these draconian measures is that employees feel disenfranchised and expect to gain more by leaking secrets than by contributing work and sharing in the rewards. Steve Jobs himself would never leak anything - he has a stake in the outcome that the leakers believe they don't.

wooster2• 17 years ago

This is wholly-fabricated nonsense. I worked at Apple for 5+ years and, besides for knowing what actually happens in these situations, there are a couple of dead giveaways that "Tom" was never an Apple employee (or, at least, not in Cupertino).

brown9-2• 17 years ago

Such as?

wooster2• 17 years ago

"They don't ask for cameras because there are no cameras at Apple: Employees are not allowed to get into the campus with them."

I mean, really, come on. That's just laughable.

CamperBob• 17 years ago

They don't ask for cameras because there are no cameras at Apple: Employees are not allowed to get into the campus with them. If the cellphone is an iPhone, it gets backed up onto a laptop. "In fact, at the beginning they used to say that the iPhones were really their property, since Apple gave every employee a free iPhone," he points out. All the employees are asked to unlock and disable any locking features in their cellphones, and then the special forces will proceed to check them for recent activity.

ROFL. Gizmodo.com has been trolled.

shalmanese• 17 years ago

A quick Google reveals no references of any Worldwide Loyalty Team before this Gizmodo "expose". I call bullshit on the entire article.

Apple Gestapo: How Apple Hunts Down Leaks

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