Trying to set Linux up is making me feel like a noob

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=98009

by daniel-cussen • 19 years ago

12 47 19 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

This sucks. I've been trying to get the linux os set up for two whole days, and I've consulted about 60 websites on how to do it. I might add that while I suck at using computers, most everyone else sucks more. As far as I'm concerned, linux is completely inaccessible for most everybody because the frictional cost of changing from windows to linux is enormous.

I'm still trying to install it. Wish me luck; it might take a few more days.

Hexstream• 19 years ago

Would probably be easier to help if we knew what distro you're trying to install...

thingsilearned• 19 years ago

Just install Ubuntu. Couldn't be easier.

hhm5• 19 years ago

I agree. I don't know what distro you are using, but you shouldn't have problems installing Ubuntu.

daniel-cussen10• 19 years ago

I'm trying ubuntu. I checked the hash on the ISO I made on the disk, and it's right, but I'm not sure what problem I'm having. First, I'm not sure I burned the CD as an image. Second, I've been unable to partition my hard drive because windows is in Spanish. Whenever I try to boot the computer after telling the BIOS to prioritize the CD-ROM, it just opens Windows as if there was nothing in there. When I give priority to the CD and nothing else, it says there's a disk error and that I need to put the system disk in.

What's most likely the problem?

iamelgringo• 19 years ago

The learning curve on Linux if you're coming from a complete Windows background is really steep. Also, each distribution has it's own pain points, and advantages. Some ditro's I'd stay clear of until you're on your way to being something of a Linux.

But, that's kind of the point of learning Linux. Feel like a noob because you are a noob. But, after setting the system up, you will have learned tons about how your computer works. Keep at it. You'll get it.

manvsmachine2• 19 years ago

The choice of distros definitely is key. How bad it is also depends on how long you've been working with computers in general. I've noticed that people who started pre-Win95 tend to make the transition a bit more easily. It helps a little if you're at least comfortable working with a CLI, doing basic scripting, etc.

Tichy2• 19 years ago

I don't think that is the case anymore. At least Ubuntu is a lot easier to use than Windows. Although granted, a few thinks have to be set up properly before the fun can begin, like video codecs.

fauigerzigerk• 19 years ago

It's not simply a matter of learning curves. I would say vi has a pretty steep learning curve, but you get something out of it if you do learn it. Same for using a Unix shell effectively. On the other hand, knowing about Linux driver issues has no value in itself for any regular user.

Setting up Linux on a laptop is always a gamble. Sometimes it works flawlessly and at other times it's a nightmare. I recently tried to make Ubuntu work on one particular laptop. Installing it was no problem whatsoever, but the CPU just wouldn't enter C3 power state, which meant that it ran extremely hot.

I tried to deactivate every single driver to find out which one kept the CPU busy. I had to resolve all the driver interdependencies, recompile the kernel, etc. But even on a completely stripped down OS the CPU just wouldn't enter C3. None of the many tips and tricks on various Linux on laptops sites would work.

Could I have pursued this further? Sure, and at some point I would have found a solution, but it wasn't worth my time frankly.

I think Linux on laptop/desktop can work if hardware vendors get behind it and sort out all the driver issues. Everything else can be resolved by the Linux community but drivers are unsuitable for the open source model as long as some hardware vendors keep their specs secret.

pivo• 19 years ago

I find it easier to install Linux than Windows, but that's probably because I'm more familiar with Linux. Anyway, unless you're using a geek linux distro, you really shouldn't be having such a hard time. Ubuntu, Kubuntu, or (my favorite) Fedora 8 should all be really easy to install.

Also, what exactly is the problem you're having? You'll get more help if you have more specific problems.

noonespecial• 19 years ago

Heh, I feel that pain. I tried to install Vista about a week ago after not having run windows since 2001. I never did get it all working right, plus thanks to (I think) not having some drivers right, my 2Ghz dual core with 3 gig ram was so slow it was unusable. I'm out of time for now but I'll try agian later in a few weeks after I buy some "vista ready" gear.

paulgb• 19 years ago

"linux is completely inaccessible for most everybody because the frictional cost of changing from windows to linux is enormous."

Unfortunately there isn't a whole lot the Linux community can do about that. The only reason Windows is so accessible to so many people is that it comes on their computer. I doubt if most Windows users would be able to install the OS from scratch.

I have to agree with you on some level though; Ubuntu is great and it has been my primary OS for several years now, but I can't say I would recommend for a non-geek to use it instead of Windows. It excites me, though, that with every release I get closer and closer to being able to do that.

euccastro• 19 years ago

Well, if it's your first time installing it, you are a newbie.

daniel-cussen10• 19 years ago

Update (3 hours after posting): I'm trying again, this time with a new CD. Thanks for the advice; I hope it works.

daniel-cussen10• 19 years ago

Now I'm getting a message that says

1. HD System Type-(00) Missing operating system

Crap.

sadiq• 19 years ago

http://goodbye-microsoft.com/ is your friend.

It lets you install Debian from within Windows (and is different from wubi, as it does a proper install).

Tichy2• 19 years ago

Sounds as if it still not booting from CD. Actually with the Ubuntu CD, the Ubuntu Live System could come up first (without you doing anything). Does that happen?

hhm5• 19 years ago

Daniel, your problem is the way you are burning the iso. You are burning it as a file, while you have to burn it as a image file. Read this: http://www.petri.co.il/how_to_write_iso_files_to_cd.htm

I think this'll put an end to your problems.

imgabe• 19 years ago

I'm going to go off of everyone else's diagnoses that the ISO is not being properly burnt. If this is indeed the case, Ubuntu has some very clear directions for burning the ISO to disc.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BurningIsoHowto

Hope that helps.

Also, if you still can't burn the CD for some reason, Ubuntu will ship you a CD for free.

http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu

damien2• 19 years ago

Another option, which is more noob-friendly is: http://wubi-installer.org/

It let's you install Linux from within Windows, as if you were just installing another Windows program. The main downside to this is that your disk IO will suffer since it installs Ubuntu inside of a Windows file (as a virtual disk).

Also, installing an OS is not for everyone. You can simply purchase a Dell, HP or Lenovo with Linux pre-installed, and that gets rid of the "frictional cost" of switching.

kashif• 19 years ago

Download the Alternate CD of Ubuntu and use that, it should work in your case..

corentin• 19 years ago

Plus, the alternate CD allows you to enable on-the-fly disk encryption, which IMHO is a must-have on a laptop.

himanshu• 19 years ago

The true learning experience comes from learning how to install linux even it means initially struggling but eventually figuring it out.

kajecounterhack• 19 years ago

While we're on the topic of installing Ubuntu which is agreed to be the easiest, may I recommend Ubuntu Ultimate

http://ultimateedition.info/Ubuntu_Ultimate_1.6/

Its just normal ubuntu but with different default packages installed, which are actually really useful (go to the site and read about it), and all repositories enabled.

Some people really don't like this because they say its annoying but most people really end up downloading all these packages anyway...might as well save the hassle. Not to mention it comes with an interesting default theme.

lyime• 19 years ago

there is nothing wrong in being a noob. But hey you are learning the right way;)

herdrick• 19 years ago

So, you are trying to do Linux on the desktop? Why?

Linux for your server, Mac or Windows on your desktop.

hhm5• 19 years ago

Why? Plenty of people uses Linux on the desktop, I myself have been running it on the desktop for some years now.

eru• 19 years ago

Why not?

christefano• 19 years ago

Considering that the original post has almost nothing to do with Linux, the helpfulness and positive attitudes in this thread amaze me.

I've been spending too much time at Slashdot.

DarrenStuart• 19 years ago

try virtualization something like vmplayer should do it.

daniel-cussen10• 19 years ago

I feel like every person who writes a guide to installing ubuntu glosses over at least a few critical details. I'm rather sick of this shit.

(I'm also trying to install rails on my mac. It's also ridiculous. You download 2 gigs of stuff, follow every instruction to the letter, and then your computer says

daniel-cussens-computer:~/src danielcussen$ mate .~/.bash_login -bash: mate: command not found

and

Error 2740. An unknown token can't go after this identifier.

which basically translates to: Error: PWNAGE! L2P, noob.)

To some up, at least in my experience, the amount of BS a user has to go through to get linux is rather enormous. I hope it's just the messed-up, non-generic user settings on my computers, but the amount of crap I've had to do makes Linux a complete impossibility for anyone who doesn't know what hexadecimal code is. But I accept the bullshit, because I know it's a right of passage, and it's worthwhile to know what a disk image, a disk ISO 9660 format (or is it file system?), a BIOS, booting priority, repartitioning, defragmenting, checking md5 hashes, and a virtual machine is. I'm going to make it happen if it takes me all week. But from a user-friendliness point of view, this is hell. I shouldn't have to know any of those things. I hope my situation is rare, because if it's not, the linux community has some serious problems.

tx3• 19 years ago

I feel like every person who writes a guide to installing ubuntu glosses over at least a few critical details. I'm rather sick of this shit.

I feel like people who write those tutorials assume a basic computer literacy from their readers. I am not assaulting you, I am replying to an assault: you have no idea how to burn a bootable CD. Period. You're not even ready to install an OS, any kid of OS. So go get yourself a basic "Build your own PC" kind of book, read it, and then try more advanced tasks such as installing operating systems.

daniel-cussen10• 19 years ago

It's true. I'm not computer literate. I thought I was, but that is because I underestimated what computer literacy meant. I thought that if I knew how to change the BIOS, knew how to burn a disc, and could unzip files, I could install Linux.

Another problem is that my situation is probably an outlier. My computer is in Spanish, which makes it a lot harder to mess with. Plus, it runs on Windows XP from 2002. On top of that, my disk drives are slightly messed up. They burn correctly according to the MD5 hashes, but one of them might not read well. Finally, none of the two computer-literate people I know are around, and "build your own PC" books are hard to find, universally in Spanish, and expensive (here in Santiago).

I'll keep trying until I find the stupid mistake I've been making all along.

And you're right. I'm being hostile; I've spent too much time over the computer over the last few days, and I'm going a little crazy. But, much like being drunk, driving oneself crazy does not excuse what you do/say when you're kind of crazy. I apologize.

Edit: both CD drives work properly.

Edit: I followed the tutorial, and burned the CD. I'm going to reboot now (both fingers crossed).

h3st• 19 years ago

Dude. Buy a dell with ubuntu, or one of those wal-mart computers wit gOS. Or call up a computer dude to fix your computer for you. Or order correctly-burned ubuntu cds.

goofygrin• 19 years ago

I've been using linux off and on since 1995-1996 (gosh, has it been that long?).

It's only been in the last couple years that I feel confortable enough to use it day to day as a primary OS (actually put it on my wife's laptop and she's fine with it surprisingly enough).

So all the seat time you've got with Windows? You don't have that with Linux and you're going to have problems.

Anyone that says the switch is painless blah blah is high on the rock.

Y creo que hay algo que no esta configurado correctamente en su BIOS (para boot desde el DVD). Tambien es posible que el disco no fue quemado (burned) correctamente....

Trying to set Linux up is making me feel like a noob

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