Apple again offers matte screen option for 15-inch MacBook Pro

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/08/11/apple_again_offers_matte_screen_option_for_15_inch_macbook_pro.html

by peter123 • 17 years ago

66 65 17 years ago

mcantor• 17 years ago

I don't like how the two laptops they're using as examples in the photo at the bottom have different desktop backgrounds and screen contents. They could have at least cleared the desktop and used the same wallpaper.

cookiecaper2• 17 years ago

In what situation would someone prefer glossy? I don't get that. Glossy is obviously much worse. Can someone explain this to me?

DannoHung• 17 years ago

They look nice inside when there's no crap on them?

stepherm• 17 years ago

It tends to make the screen look brighter and more vibrant. Most consumers seem to think that means it's a "better" screen.

CamperBob• 17 years ago

Make your widget look better in the store, and you sell more widgets. A trick as old as TV retailing.

axod2• 17 years ago

Blacks look blacker :/ In the right lighting it looks far brighter with better contrast I think. Just depends on what your lighting is though.

modoc2• 17 years ago

I use my laptop mostly indoors in my home office with controlled lighting. The glossy screen looks better, deeper blacks, more vibrant colors, etc... While I wouldn't use it for photo or pre-press work, I really like it in general.

cookiecaper2• 17 years ago

But isn't the point of a laptop portability? The glossy screen makes it significantly less portable -- in anything but ideal lighting, everything in front of the screen is reflected in a way that interferes with the intended image. That just doesn't sound conducive to usefulness in a laptop.

If you just use it inside your home office, why buy a laptop in the first place?

bhousel• 17 years ago

I think glossy screens are a lot easier to clean.. I'm pretty picky about fingerprints :(

prodigal_erik• 17 years ago

If glare is coming from one direction, glossy can be good or terrible depending on where you point it. Matte is just always equally bad, and turning the brightness up is all you can do.

martythemaniak• 17 years ago

Cool. Even the handsome narcissists like me get tired of looking at themselves all day long.

alaskamiller• 17 years ago

That's why Apple made Photo Booth and the blue screen backgrounds.

dlevine2• 17 years ago

It's interesting how responsive Apple is to customer feedback. A lot of times, customers complain about Apple's new product leaving out some feature, and then the next revision magically incorporates that feature (a good example would be Firewire on the 13-inch macbooks).

They aren't at all vocal about this, so people see Apple as being super closed, but I think that they do care a lot about what customers think. They design products that people want for a reason. Sure it involves thinking outside the box and offering products that people never imagined asking for. But it also requires listening to customers' opinions and integrating that into future product revisions.

mcantelon• 17 years ago

I would say this a good example of them being closed and not appearing to care what their customers think:

http://mantia.me/blog/macbook-pro-thousands-of-colors

And, showing this isn't a one-time thing:

http://www.betanews.com/article/Apple-Sued-Over-MacBook-Disp...

dlevine2• 17 years ago

To set the record straight, virtually all laptop panels are 6-bit.

raquo4• 17 years ago

They wouldn't have needed to bring back matte displays have they listened to their users and not removed this option in the first place.

I don't know why they fanatically remove useful features and options. It's 2009, and I can't even choose a _custom_ color to serve as a wallpaper for Mac OS X, only one of _ten_ colors provided by Apple. It's so unimaginably idiotic to have to create a png file for this purpose.

andylei• 17 years ago

it's in a post above, but they "removed" this option from their newly designed laptops because it requires an entirely different screen construction. i also don't think the majority of users want matte screens, even if many do.

jodrellblank2• 17 years ago

That's an incredibly weak example of a "useful feature or option".

gommm2• 17 years ago

and I just bought a macbook pro 1 week ago :-( ... hopefully I can return it...

lsb• 17 years ago

If you can prove it's <2 weeks old, it's just the 10% or 15% unboxing fee.

gommm2• 17 years ago

Thanks, I'll have to check problem is that I bought it in Hong Kong and I'm in China right now....

yalestar• 17 years ago

Amen to this. I've never understood the appeal of glossy displays. To me they're almost unusuable except under the most ideal lighting conditions.

cesare2• 17 years ago

Glossy displays are cheaper to make (since they lack the anti-glare coating).

Most consumers even prefer glossy vs matte (especially when they see them side to side at the shop) because the matte coating (obviously) reduces brightness and colors are perceived as less vibrant. Of course, as soon as you have to work with them (apart from viewing a movie in a dark room) you'll regret it.

Cheaper + clueless consumer = market trend.

The previous generation of MBP had both options. I bought the matte, and the price (IIRC) was the same.

I believe that Apple didn't offer this option for these models from the beginning because the screen of unibody machines has glass in front of it and so the process to add the coating wasn't ready yet or it was much more costly.

aasarava• 17 years ago

It's interesting that a lot of people feel that glossy screens look better in the showroom. When I'm in an Apple Store or a Best Buy or wherever, the overhead lighting is often so bright that all you can see on glossy laptop screens is glare and reflection. It's exactly because of this showroom experience that I've always avoided glossy laptop screens.

GHFigs• 17 years ago

When you order the matte option, the whole glass panel and bezel are removed and replaced with an aluminum frame like the earlier models. It is not merely a coating applied to the glass, it's a different part entirely.

pmjordan3• 17 years ago

It's odd, though - in some European countries, the glossy screens are considered ergonomically harmful and are therefore banned from the workplace. So you can't give your employees iMacs, smaller Macbooks, etc. to work on. You'd think Apple would be a bit keener to sell to businesses.

michaelneale• 17 years ago

Yes there is probably a name for the affect of things like gloss, or brightness in a shop causing increated sales (yet its actually an inferior feature). Its the same reason LCDs have brightness and colour cranked up in shops, stereos are played loud etc...

Having said that, the glass on the unibody does look easy to keep clean.

javanix2• 17 years ago

No kidding.

They look nicer when the computer is turned off? Is that really worth the extra glare for people?

axod2• 17 years ago

I don't think it's quite as clear cut.

Matte never look black, more a sort of dark grey. Contrast+brightness on glossy seems better.

jvdh• 17 years ago

The glossy displays on the MacBook pros are actually not that bad. They ramp up to such a high brightness that you can defeat any glare you throw at it.

I've used my macbook pro in the full midday sun on my back with no problem. The matte screen on my 15" powerbook was pretty much unusable outside unless it was dark.

electromagnetic2• 17 years ago

I think this is likely more due to the change to LED for back lighting.

What the problem is with glossy displays is that they act like a half-silvered piece of glass. If the brightness on the outside gets too high, they turn into a mirror and it's near impossible to see through. However if the brightness remains high on the inside, you can see through with perfect clarity.

So long as the back lighting can get brighter than the fore lighting, the glossy screen can be amazing. It has a few problems, like glares (where reflections and such cause light levels to peak higher than the back light), however these are really only a problem if you have to max out your back light.

Apple should be designing their laptop screens like they do their iPod screens. My brightness on my iPod is set to ~0% and inside it is perfect, even for most tv shows (no dark moody movies though), and outside I rarely need to put it up to 100% on the sunniest of days. This would be the ideal, but until laptops actually become ultra-portable I don't think this is a huge concern.

I think it's a trend of the new-geek to want to be outside in nature when working, so hopefully some ultra-powerful back lights are going to be available on high-end laptops for use outside.

LegionSB2• 17 years ago

Nonsense. You have it backwards. Matte screens really require the ideal lighting conditions.

Easy test: take one of each, and go outside.

Sunlight washes out a matte screen to the point of being impossible to use.

Glossy screens reflect much of that light away, leaving the screen still legible.

As someone that used to do a lot of work outdoors on a laptop, there's no comparison. Glossy screens are usable in FAR, FAR more varied lighting conditions. Too much direct light and a matte screen becomes completely useless.

SwellJoe2• 17 years ago

This hasn't been my experience at all. My previous lappy had a glossy screen, and I simply couldn't use it outside, and it's one of the reasons I didn't buy an Apple laptop when I got a new one a couple of months ago (bought a Dell Latitude with a super bright matte screen that works great indoors and out).

I think saying, "Glossy screens reflect much of that light away, leaving the screen still legible" is magical thinking. The reflected light goes into your eye, just like the light that's coming from the screen.

A sufficiently bright glossy screen and placing the lappy out of direct sunlight could overcome this problem, but I'm pretty darned sure matte screens work better than shiny ones outdoors.

carpo• 17 years ago

That's not my experience, either. I just got a new laptop and chose a matte screen because my previous glossy screen was impossible to use on the train as any bit of sun turned the display into a mirror. The matte screen is much, much better.

eggnet• 17 years ago

So in scenarios where you have direct sunlight shining on your screen, glossy is better.

On the other hand a glossy screen is a mirror and distracting compared to a matte screen in all other cases.

I've never been in a situation where I couldn't prevent direct sunlight from hitting my screen. I am in conditions all the time where reflections would distract me and I cannot orient the screen to fix it. This doesn't seem like a difficult decision.

antidaily• 17 years ago

Easy test if you somehow have two macbook pros sitting around... including one that has a matte screen which apparently just became available again today.

raquo4• 17 years ago

So now they acknowledge that glossy screen is even $50 _inferior_ to matte.

mustpax• 17 years ago

That's one way to look at it. Another way would be that lower production volume for matte screens means higher per unit cost, so they have to make up for this with the additional $50.

raquo4• 17 years ago

Maybe. However, before Apple removed the matte option I have never seen a glossy screen on an apple laptop (except in their stores). Sample size is not that big, though.

kineticac• 17 years ago

They might have been reluctant to bring back the matte, so they tried to see if they could make $50 off of each one, and it sure did. I wonder what's next, take out the "space" key on the keyboard and charge $10 for it?

figital• 17 years ago

The glossy screens are certainly nicer for watching crisp video. I wish I had gotten the matte screen as I don't watch much on my computer. (Glossy certainly looks better in the showroom)

I did buy a screen protector at the Mac Store for my iTouch which mimics a matte finish on top of the glossy screen. If I were to buy the upcoming larger-screen iTouch tablet I would highly recommend getting a matte finish to cut down on glare & fingerprints, etc.

Tichy• 17 years ago

Actually I don't like video on my MacBooks glossy screen. The reason is that dark backgrounds make the reflection much more noticeable. While I work, I tend to have a lot of white in the background, and it is very usable. Videos tend to have a lot of dark scenes, so the reflections get very annoying.

ahpeeyem• 17 years ago

I wish they would offer some decent resolutions as well...the 13" with 1400x900 would be nice (like on a lenovo X301), and 15" with 1920x1050 (like you can get on a dell xps 1550) would be so good! Who wants to lug a 17" lump around to get decent res?

psadauskas• 17 years ago

I think the standard widescreen aspect for the 15" would be 1680x1050. I'm holding off my MBP purchase for that. My current 14" dell has 1440x900, I can't understand why the "better" screens on the MBP's have such poor resolution.

moe• 17 years ago

Tradition. Apple laptop screens have always been subpar. Worse panels, worse lighting, worse resolution than what you'd get in a similarly priced PC laptop.

I guess this has to do with the screen being one of the most expensive parts and apple selling smaller quantities than other manufacturers. Better panels would likely eat into their margin significantly.

Anyways Apple is not dumb and has long realized that this flaw can be trivially concealed simply by ensuring that your product is never on display side-by-side with competing brands.

Hence the apple-isles...

jac_no_k• 17 years ago

Same here. I'm looking to replace my aging Dell Inspiron 8600, which is a 15.4" display with 1920x1200 matte finish display. A 15" Mac Book Pro is very tempting but I too wish they would offer a higher dot pitch. But my eyes are older and find myself increasing the font size in code as the day wears on. The alternate is to connect to a large desktop display when available.

Not having the option to be able to go to an insane dot pitch on the Mac Book Pro is helping to keep my wallet shut.

jacobolus• 17 years ago

Screen resolution increases are blocking on resolution-independent UI. Apple's been actively working on it for quite a while now, and the next OS release changes the UI target gamma, and will need mostly redrawn graphics, so we can only hope that real resolution independence isn't too far away.

entelarust• 17 years ago

I have so many problems with my matte macbook pro. Dust collection mainly. I will definitely go with glossy on my next mac.

bkj123• 17 years ago

I can't believe this post has over 35 comments (+1 for mine)

baddox• 17 years ago

Charging for the option? I fail to understand that, and I didn't expect it, even from Apple.

jpcx01• 17 years ago

Even for something as trivial as this, this is just one of those weird cases where you look around at the world, and want to yell, "what the hell is wrong with you people"?

I don't understand why anyone would own a glossy screen.

jodrellblank2• 17 years ago

Even for something as trivial as this, this is just one of those weird cases where you look around at the world, and wonder "Why are you compelled to post that you don't understand something?"

People are making, selling, designing, buying owning glossy screens. This means your mental model is way out of alignment with reality.

But that's not a problem, there are several explanations in the comments on this very page which you can read and then you will understand why people own glossy screens.

1) That was the only option if you wanted a new MacBook Pro.

2) Even now, it's the cheaper option to purchase.

2) They make blacks look blacker and screens look shinier, which is (subjectively) desirable.

3) Because of this, they're (subjectively) nicer for looking at pictures and movies on.

4) Under many use scenarios, there are no downsides because it's pretty easy to position it so there's no glare.

5) There is no ugly bezel around the edge of the screen as there is for the matte screens so it (subjectively) looks nicer.

6) It's the sort of small thing that can be easily overlooked, or not noticed if ordering online, and someone could end up buying one without knowing in advance that the glare would annoy them, then ignoring it as a minor inconvenience.

Apple again offers matte screen option for 15-inch MacBook Pro

Related Stories