Amazon.com: as frugal as ever?

http://www.techflash.com/Amazoncom_as_frugal_as_ever50259767.html

by cwan • 17 years ago

20 8 17 years ago

gruseom2• 17 years ago

As a meme for perpetuating culture, turning off vending machine lights is superb symbolism.

I know a guy who did some consulting for Walmart and visited their HQ. He told me they had a conference room where, instead of paying for a projector, they stuck an old CRT monitor on top of a milk crate. Although he didn't get anywhere near the executive sanctum (perhaps if you get high enough, they don't practice what they preach), he observed many such cultural indicators in the middle tier.

mediaman• 17 years ago

I believe Wal-Mart practices their preaching even at the higher levels. For example, I know a number of management consultants who work for the big brand name consultancies. They travel each week to work at their client's site, and usually stay at classy hotels: the Ritz, Four Seasons, etc., and the clients don't care because they already spend $X million on consultants, so who cares if they're spending $500 a night per person for hotel costs? Besides, they're advising the board, or the president and C-suite, so there's no point in worrying about costs.

But Wal-Mart cared. The consultants had to stay at cheap hotels. (For these people, that was traumatizing.) Their receipts were reviewed and per diem spending caps enforced. (Very uncommon. These people like to rack up $1,000 bar tabs and charge it to the client.) Most of the team did not even fly down there, to save costs. (Seems obvious, but that's not usually done.) That made them an unpopular client among the jet set, but they sure saved a lot of money.

philwelch• 17 years ago

I remember watching the documentary. In a lot of companies, the CEO's office is at the corner of some mid-rise or high-rise office building, overlooking New York or something. We all know the Sears Tower, and Woolworth had an innovative skyscraper in their day. Wal-Mart's Bentonville headquarters is a small, unremarkable office building, and their CEO has a small first floor office with a view of the parking lot.

rdvm• 17 years ago

Holy hell. How many vending machines do you have to have to save $20K by turning of the lights?

ATB• 17 years ago

I worked at Amazon until very recently. Some thoughts on the article:

"Amazon — where workers famously had desks made of wooden doors nailed to two-by-fours in the company’s earlier, money-losing days — remans in some ways as cheap as ever"

Everywhere I went, Amazon still used 'door desks' which are basically doors with legs. They are sturdy, come in various sizes, and are assembled and disassembled easily. There's an award named after them (the "Door Desk Award") that Amazon hands out fairly often, and there's a competition to see how quickly Amazon people can assemble one of them from parts (Jeff Bezos is pretty quick, IIRC).

"Amazon’s frugal ways reflect “more their culture than the immediate economic conditions.”"

Wherever you go, people will casually mention that Amazon "tries to be frugal." The last time I heard this, it was during an office move where I did a lot of the moving myself (instead of relying on the facility staff to do it) after an executive assistant casually mentioned that "we value frugality" so I figured that staff may be put to better use elsewhere. I've been around VPs and never got the impression that they felt comfortable splashing out a lot of cash unless there was a clear need to do so. This culture extends to the very top.

"the company’s relatively modest record of charitable giving has drawn some unfavorable reviews"

Amazon became profitable after many unprofitable years not that long ago (2002). It's probably easier to give a lot to charity if you've been making billions in profits year after year.

Kirby• 17 years ago

I also used to work at Amazon, and this is all true.

Personally, I like having an ergonomically reasonable desk, and don't miss my door desk at all.

The downside of frugal is, employees don't feel treated as well. Amazon had free coffee and water, and that's it. No sodas, no free vending machines, none of that kind of stuff that are reasonably common in software development houses. The cafeteria on-site is not any cheaper than eating out (though the food isn't bad.) The office supplies are always the cheapest possible - use a bic pen or buy your own if you actually care about your writing utensil. Company swag, like free T-Shirts, are a rare thing. And the 'employee discount' is distinctly unimpressive - 10% off for the first $1000 per year, aka $100.

It's all little things, but it can add up to a feeling of being a cog in an uncaring machine. It wasn't really related to why I left, but I can't say I miss being part of the Amazon family. People vary, but for me, I honestly think things like free vending machines generate more long-term good will than if they'd paid me ten times that amount in a bonus instead.

tybris• 17 years ago

Personally, I find it silly to get paid in beverages if I could get paid in cash. Then again, when I was at Amazon I was in downtown Seattle with some of the greatest lunch bars in the world (read: Tats) and not on top of a suburban hill.

gruseom2• 17 years ago

That's very interesting. I've always been irritated by the emphasis software companies (or at least, journalists writing about software companies) put on things like free drinks and ping pong tables. Give me great work with great people and you can toss the rest of it; conversely, all that free crap doesn't do a thing for me if the work and the people aren't great.

At the same time, I've heard from many sources that Amazon isn't such a great place to work. I imagine there must be other cultural factors besides cheapness that contribute to that?

Amazon.com: as frugal as ever?

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