What's with the silence?

http://farukat.es/journal/2013/02/681-silence

by KuraFire • 13 years ago

25 42 13 years ago

NathanKP• 13 years ago

The most telling thing for me when I was reading this post is that I was just looking at the words and assumed the author was a woman, because they were writing about sexism and poor treatment of women in the tech industry. It wasn't until I scrolled back up and looked at the image in the sidebar that I realized the author of the post was actually male.

Not that men don't ever write about such issues, but I guess I'm so used to seeing such articles penned by women that I assumed that this one was also written by a woman. That mental bias I experienced alone is demonstrative of how rarely men speak out.

Zikes6• 13 years ago

Honestly, I'm just here to learn and make a living.

There are many issues in society which I abhor, including all forms of sexism, corruption, violence, the list goes on. I try to live to the best of my ability and without contributing negatively to any of the aforementioned issues, but I have my own crosses to bear, I cannot carry all of yours.

KuraFire13• 13 years ago

That’s the point of the article though: you don’t need to be an activist, but silence itself is a negative contribution. Simply the act of tweeting links to such articles and saying you agree with it, is enough to let people know you’ve got their backs in this matter.

philwelch14• 13 years ago

Silence is a non-contribution. You put too much stock in the leftist notion "if you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem", an interesting euphemism for the old slogan "if you're not with us, you're against us."

Zikes6• 13 years ago

If I have to enumerate every single common sense evil in all its degrees and flavors to be considered a good and honest citizen, then I will never finish writing.

xyandnoz• 13 years ago

Actually I think silence is still preferable to what happens more frequently -- the sexist trolls are actively praised and rewarded in the tech community. Not for their sexism, of course, but for their activism on behalf of freedom of speech, etc. We don't just fail to speak against them, we -- in the tech world -- often hail them as heroes for their other work, while conveniently ignoring the misogyny or writing it off as just "sure, he's not politically correct, but..." or "sure, he can hurt feelings and ruffle feathers but..."

Or the way Reddit is still seen as a "good" place despite a model that not just encourages but needs people like ViolentAcrez. We don't have to speak out about the bad things in order to make a difference... We can start by not speaking FOR the contexts in which it is not just tolerated but subtly, behind the scenes, reinforced. Stopping support for sites that allow this behavior is a huge step that does not require speaking out. Because most sites that "allow" it are also, one way or another, also encouraging it. We get the behavior that we reinforce.

wilkie• 13 years ago

Think about how little time you and I have to devote to these issues. And then think about how we don't have to suffer them. And yet, women and your non-white-male must spend some of their time (that time we may spend coding, or reading, etc) to deal with discrimination, sexism, and the like. The minimum one could do to lessen this burden is to simply look around and listen with the determination to understand their issues, and with that understanding, speak out and be heard so that others may understand as well. Can we really say that we won't do this? Can the rest of us that are not commenting really let people suggest inaction and let those we care about down? Let's come together to be better than that.

mwetzler• 13 years ago

Thank you Faruk! Keep up the good work.

philwelch14• 13 years ago

In my admittedly limited experience, I haven't seen anything to speak out about. I appreciate when others report their experiences and don't want to invalidate them, but if I'm "silent" it's because I simply have nothing to add to the conversation.

Outrage propagates itself perfectly well without my help. The fact is, I've seen more outrage over sexism in the developer community than I've seen sexism in the developer community.

KuraFire13• 13 years ago

You (and, especially, the women you’ve worked with) are either very fortunate, or you’re not talking to women enough for them to reveal to you what they’re experiencing. I’ve worked in several different countries, various different cultures, and I have yet to work with a woman who didn’t notice or experience various forms of sexism. And most men I know are aware of it, too, but don't necessarily know what the best way of dealing with it is.

As an side, I really do suggest you read some of the stuff posted to http://everydaysexism.com/ for example. There is a chance you're not seeing the sexism for sexism.

philwelch14• 13 years ago

I don't currently work with any women in a technical capacity. When I did, I reported to her and didn't witness any problems. The women I work with in a non-technical capacity seem to do fine, though I spend more time doing my job than trying to catalogue every hidden oppression they may or may not face.

Thanks for the link, but if I wanted to keep myself continually outraged over anonymous anecdotes, I'd spend more time on Reddit.

What's with the silence?

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