Ask HN: How do you convince people to use privacy respecting technologies

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45667253

by bogomil • 9 months ago

12 15 9 months ago

news.ycombinator.com

I just submitted talk proposals for FOSDEM. It goes beyond my usual ramblings on what privacy foss tools we must use and it covers the "how" to convince people to start using them.

If you have encouraged someone to switch to say Signal, or Sessions, or XMPP or some other tool/protocol, please share here.

I need as much success stories as possible.

----- Anonymity is guaranteed if requested, you can use my Sessions messenger session: 0531634331f5b6be12375bf4229412eed3f2f3543cfe119df37e1b72c883143d4a

bogomil6• 9 months ago

Since I can't edit, I want to mention that I will give you the credit while presenting (if you wish of course). Thank you!

Bender2• 9 months ago

Not so much switch, but rather "fall back to" a self hosted instance of uMurmur, IRC, etc... when Discord is down or if the topic is too sensitive for a shared corporate platform. People will stay were their friends are. Having a fall-back solution that gives them more privacy or a way to remain in contact when their primary means are down can be useful at times.

How vigilant people are about privacy will vary greatly by generation and by group interests.

bogomil6• 9 months ago

So in this case the trigger is the system is down and we need to understand how do we keep doing what we do as a group. But then when the main system is back, how do we keep them into the new one?

Bender2• 9 months ago

how do we keep them into the new one?

This goes back to the variation by generation and group interests. People that already feel oppressed by the main platform may likely stay on the one you provided them, otherwise most will go back to whatever they and their friends liked about their main platform. Unless these people are your employees it is unlikely you would be deciding where they go. Even in that case employees will do what they can do.

Ask these people what they like about the platform they are on and decide if you can replicate or enhance that experience. If you can, show them and they will decide if what you created is something they would prefer.

firefax2• 9 months ago

Do you have a Signal username? I hate dealing with PGP.

(That's how I've gotten a lot of folks on Signal: "It's like PGP, but usable." The phone number thing was a hangup for a while but with the usernames feature, that's gone.)

bogomil6• 9 months ago

Interesting point. What's hard in PGP? Are you setting up manually or via an app like Thunderbird?

firefax2• 9 months ago

What's hard in PGP?

WebTV crashed when I tried to Ask Jeeves how many thesises (thesii?) have been written on this subject.

atmosx2• 9 months ago

Is XMPP considered secure? I use it daily because it's the PM protocol that doesn't require a mobile phone and works with CLI clients.. I use profanity :-P

bogomil6• 9 months ago

it could be. How can you convince more people to use it?

atmosx2• 9 months ago

By building better clients.

al_borland• 9 months ago

I think the key is to just make the best service. For the masses, privacy and security aren’t selling points. Make the core product great, and then it happens to also be privacy respecting FOSS.

Of all the FOSS software that has made inroads with the masses, none of it has been due to it being FOSS or the privacy. People don’t use VLC because it’s FOSS, they use it because a video file didn’t play in the player they had, and VLC played it without and fuss.

Solve problems users have. They don’t see not being FOSS as a problems. So yes, make FOSS, but don’t expect that to be your headline feature. Like it or not, very few people actually care.

bogomil6• 9 months ago

spot on, thanks!

jakabia• 9 months ago

I'm not sure how private and secure Telegram is, but I convinced many people to switch. The main reason behind every switch was not the better privacy, but the greater product: features, that the mainstream alternative did not have.

bogomil6• 9 months ago

That's a good point. Thanks for sharing. I would not comment on the Telegram's privacy at this moment.

beardyw• 9 months ago

You are missing out the "which means that ..." step. A basic of sales training is that you take your proposal and then put that at the end. Take the answer and repeat until you run out of sensible answers. What you have is your best proposal.

Privacy is a concept, it's not even a thing.

Ask HN: How do you convince people to use privacy respecting technologies

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