Stand up for Julian Assange before it's too late

by Garbage • 14 years ago

117 39 14 years ago

10 minutes expected time on an extradution that is unecessary. I think they have already made up their mind. The best case scenario is that he will never be seen again, the worst? they will kill him.

objclxt2• 14 years ago

Sigh

This topic tends to cause people with no knowledge or experience of the English legal system to come out with some crazy stuff.

Firstly, judgements in England are typically delivered orally. The ten minutes refers to the time taken to read out the judgement in open court, not the time taken to deliberate.

Secondly, and this is a very important point that people here tend to forget, this has nothing to do with whether he is guilty or not.

Here are the facts: Sweden issued a European arrest warrant (EAW) for Assange, and want him to face allegations of rape and sexual assault. As a member of the EU, the UK is obliged to transfer him to Sweden, as per the conditions of the warrant. The EAW is very useful, and makes a lot of sense: EU citizens can move and live between EU member states freely, and the EAW is an extension of that.

It is not of relevance to the English courts whether Assange is guilty or not: that's for the Swedish courts to ascertain. It is widely accepted amongst legal circles that Assange's defence is very weak. His defence team are trying to get him off on a technicality - the treaty that governs EU arrest warrants states that requests must be made by "competent judicial authorities", and they're arguing that the Swedish prosecutor isn't a "judicial" official.

That's it. That's all they have. Not honouring the EAW would have huge implications for extradition cases across Europe. I think it's quite likely Assange will be handed over to Sweden, but not because of some vendata or conspiracy - simply because he has no case with regards to his extradition. Assange could very well be totally innocent, but that's a matter he should argue in Sweden where the alleged offence was committed, not the UK.

drstrangevibes3• 14 years ago

While I agree that killing him would probably create more problems than it solves the facts remain.

a) judgement will be given 1 hour after the court building so thats still not much time .

Here are the facts: Sweden is trying to extradite him for the purpose of questioning, but they have refused all offers to question him via telephone or video call, despite it being a completely legal method under Swedish law.

WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange's lawyer tells CBS News that rape and sexual molestation allegations against his client in Sweden are a "stitch up," and the Swedish prosecutor's failure to provide him with documentation on the claims, or any evidence, makes it impossible to begin crafting a legal response.

Call it what you want, I call it Bullst

If charged, the following trial would be held in secret.

gregbair2• 14 years ago

Really? Do you really think a democratic country like the UK, Sweden, or the US would be so stupid as to kill such a lightning rod figure? We're not talking about backwater banana republics here, these are G20 countries with well-established legal systems.

From what I've read, he's not facing treatment any different from anyone else in this situation([1] and [2]).

It all appears to be by the book. This is not a railroading, as there have been much back and forth and waffling by the Swedish authorities whether there was a crime and whether to continue the investigation.

I think people see a conspiracy where there is none.

[1]http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/police/extradition-intro11/extr... [2]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A4ktning#H.C3.A4ktning_.2...

chj2• 14 years ago

There are plenty of ways to treat people like Assange, killing is out of fashion now.

cmdkeen2• 14 years ago

Absolute rot. If the US wanted to extradite him then the UK is a far better place to get him from thanks to our extradition treaty. Why on earth would either country state they won't extradite him when they haven't been asked to extradite him and have no idea what the grounds for any extradition might be?

The secret trial process is presumably one that gives protection to the privacy of victims of sexual assault. Sweden has its own legal system, if you happen to go to Sweden you have to abide by it - if Mr Assange doesn't like Sweden's laws regarding sex then he shouldn't have had sex in Sweden.

chris_wot3• 14 years ago

If Mr Assange doesn't like Sweden's laws regarding sex then he shouldn't have had sex in Sweden

Excuse me, but that's a remarkably ignorant comment. What you are actually saying is "If Mr Assange doesn't like Sweden's laws regarding rape then he shouldn't have committed rape in Sweden". Because he wasn't accused of having sex in Sweden (that is not in any doubt), rather the questioning is in regards to an alleged rape.

You have no proof that he committed (or did not commit) rape in Sweden.

cmdkeen2• 14 years ago

Well given you can't face claims of consentless sex without having sex I'd say it is an issue.

Anyway - the point is that Sweden takes the rights of alleged rape victims seriously. Hence why trials have privacy attached and interviewing someone remotely isn't up to scratch. If you don't like that Sweden has the balance of rights over sexual issues lying more on the woman's side than elsewhere in the world then perhaps you shouldn't have sex whilst you're in freedom.

I have no proof he committed rape in Sweden. I have an awful lot of evidence that he isn't rushing to clear his name in Sweden...

sp332• 14 years ago

I have no proof that he has a pet unicorn either. But since no one has claimed that he owns a unicorn, and he hasn't been charged with rape, I don't see a good reason to believe either claim.

morsch• 14 years ago

Do you have any details on whether Sweden or the UK are more likely to extradite to the US? Claiming that the UK has an extradition treaty isn't very meaningful, since Sweden has one, too, as do dozens of other countries for that matter. I assume it's down to the implementation details of the individual treaties.

objclxt2• 14 years ago

It wouldn't be unusual for people wanted by the US for various matters living in Europe to avoid the UK. Roman Polanski, for example, was able to testify over video-link when bringing a libel proceeding in the UK, on the basis that he was quite likely to be arrested and extradited if he was to appear in person.

Clearly Roman Polanski also believed Sweden less likely to extradite him than the UK, since he has actually visited the former (where they did arrest him, but then released him without charge back to France).

andyjohnson02• 14 years ago

The UK's extradition treaty with the US is felt by many to be skewed in favour of the US [1]. I doubt Sweden's is, but I can't find any information on it. If I felt like attributing malice to the US then I'd say it would be in their interest for Assange to remain in the UK where he would be easier to extradite.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_Act_2003#Controvers...

ck23• 14 years ago

What about Bradely Manning? It is Memorial Day after all, why has the world just forgotten about him?

gregbair2• 14 years ago

Because he did not die while serving his country? That's what Memorial Day is.

ck23• 14 years ago

His life is effectively over for serving his country and following his conscious and morals

He will live in a cell the size of a bathroom for the rest of his life and face possible torture.

While we shop at the mall he did something incredible brave.

chj2• 14 years ago

Yeah, the world has been too busy talking about a blind lawyer from China abused by Chinese authority. Manning can wait.

nextstep• 14 years ago

It's disappointing that nobody seems to support what Julian Assange was trying to do with wikileaks. This Swedish rape accusation bullshit is a distraction and a smear campaign. I was hoping for more insightful comments from HN.

CJefferson2• 14 years ago

I can support what Julian Assange was trying to do, while not liking Julian Assange himself particularly. Actually, I find it unfortunate that what I view as sich a good idea, is attached to such an apparently dodgy individual.

mike-cardwell• 14 years ago

Some would argue that the smear campaign has worked on you in exactly the way it was intended.

eli3• 14 years ago

I think wikileaks is interesting and powerful, but Julian Assange strikes me as a creep. At best he distracts from the cause he champions and at worst he really harms it. And I'm not talking about the rape accusation.

philwelch3• 14 years ago

Assange is the one who inserted his own narcissism into the question. Believe it or not, some people actually do commit rape. There's no epidemic of false accusations--hell, even true accusations bear an enormous emotional cost for the victim.

SagelyGuru• 14 years ago

Follow the link by Christine Assange (his mother) which lists many interesting points and events in chronological order.

http://wlcentral.org/node/2486

Stand up for Julian Assange before it's too late

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