My Encounter With a Patent Troll

http://www.ecommercefuel.com/patent-troll/

by spiredigital • 14 years ago

45 24 14 years ago

It's a sad state of events when any small merchant using popular shopping cart software can be harassed and bullied by trolls. I ended up writing my two Senators and House Representative (yep, single Representative. That's Montana for you!) in the hope we'll see real patent reform in the future.

For a more "news like" account of the case, with background and comment from the troll's attorney, see below:

http://www.ecommercefuel.com/ecommerce-patent-dispute/

johnsto192• 14 years ago

What is the best way to contact my elected government representatives to support a change in this area? I am not familiar enough with the laws in this area and don't really have the background knowledge to speak intelligently enough about it to be convincing. I'd really like to do my part on this but am not sure how to be effective.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

I simply emailed my U.S. senators and representative, and let them know I would be considering their stance on patent reform a major issue when deciding whether to vote for them. You can find your legislators' contact information via the following link:

http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/

You could also contact the sponsors of the recent (and weak) America Invents Act - Patrick Leahy (D-VT) and Rep. Lamar Smith (R-TX), but if you're not one of their constituents, they likely won't be too concerned with what you have to say.

If anyone else has other suggestions / tips on how to most effectively reach legislators to support patent reform, please share!

protomyth• 14 years ago

Just get a pitch you can say about how these patents are making you fearful and how you cannot possibly take such risks as starting your own business (if you haven't) and hiring (more?) people. Keep it short, be confident, practice in mirror. Check various organizations for talking points.

Find a decent suit, get a hair cut, and make yourself look like the stereotypical successful business man / woman. Find out when your representative will be in town (most have multiple offices in their district), and go to a public meeting they are holding. Be pleasant, nice, and state your point. Followup with a letter and get others to write letters on the same subject. If you know one of the big campaign donors then get them to state the same thing.

chaostheory4• 14 years ago

"That’s why it’s crucial to be legally protected with some kind of corporate structure. For most small businesses, this means creating a limited liability company."

Not all incorporations are made equal. For LLCs, I feel it depends on the state of incorporation as well as the number of members. I could be wrong, but an LLC that is either incorporated in states like CA or only has one member, can have its corporate veil easily pierced.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

I'm not an expert on laws governing LLCs in different states, and I'm sure that there are loopholes / exceptions for certain circumstances. But being setup as an LLC vs. a sole proprietorship offers you significantly more protection. If you're targeted in a lawsuit operating as a sole proprietor, I believe all your personal assets are at risk. Operating under a LLC makes it significantly harder to come after your personal assets, especially if you're good about keeping business & personal assets in separate accounts.

Another thing I've heard recommended / try to do is to always sign as a member of a LLC (include your company position next to your signature) so it's clear you're signing on behalf of the LLC and not personally.

chaostheory4• 14 years ago

"But being setup as an LLC vs. a sole proprietorship offers you significantly more protection."

IANAL: I feel this depends on whether or not the LLC has two or more members. When an LLC has one member who is active, it's not much better than a sole proprietorship. Having great legal protection is a myth about single member LLCs that needs to be broken. It's relatively easy to pierce an LLC's corporate veil. Then again someone may prove me wrong. You need to talk to a lawyer.

johnsto192• 14 years ago

What is the recommended entity type for a small e-commerce business like the OP's business?

chaostheory4• 14 years ago

IANAL so this really depends on the person's specific situation i.e. like what state is the business in, how many members there are, and so on

imo if you want more protection, you need a C-Corp or a more than one member LLC... there are caveats to both routes and everyone should talk to a real lawyer about this or books from say NOLO

DenisM2• 14 years ago

You are wrong. Source: http://www.amazon.com/Examples-Explanations-Corporations-Pri...

If you don't want to read the book, talk to a lawyer. Expensive lawyers have the first hour often (usually) free. My less expensive lawyer offered "one-hour consultation plus all filing fees" for $500 deal. That would be money well spent.

chaostheory4• 14 years ago

Do you have the exact pages or passages proving that I'm wrong? I'm not saying that I'm not wrong, but I'm really curious to see the proof since I've been told time and again that it's relatively easy to pierce the corporate veil for LLCs in California.

cedsav• 14 years ago

I think you were lucky that the patent was actually fought in court and close to a resolution. It's not always the case, so ignoring the troll may not be the best advice. Especially if the troll's lawyers are paid on a contingency basis. They have all the incentives to sue. It doesn't cost them anything, and any ruling in their favor reinforce their case.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

I agree. I was very lucky the case was so close to a resolution and that my research (and that of my wife, who has experience in the legal field) led us to believe their case was weak.

Also, as I stated in the post, I do not broadly advise ignoring legal claims:

"...if you are contacted about a patent violation, I highly recommend hiring a lawyer to look things over. The last thing you want is to ignore a legitimate infringement claim or legal issue".

naner• 14 years ago

So when is someone going to start a company offering small startups patent troll insurance? Obviously, Congress isn't going to fix anything. Other solutions need to be explored.

alainbryden• 14 years ago

I'm guessing no insurance company wants to get the middle of monitoring everything a software company does to make sure it isn't deliberately trying to get away with infringing on a bunch of patents to cut corners because they know their butt is covered by their insurance. Essentially, it would be too easy for dishonest people to take advantage of it, and too difficult for insurance companies to gather relevant metrics and set a reasonable price.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

That's a really great idea. I'd purchase troll insurance!

Unfortunately, I think you're right about Congress. It will likely require the issue spinning wildly out of the control - and a subsequent outcry - to get anything done. If we start talking about the issue now, hopefully that process won't take nearly as long....

redsymbol• 14 years ago

In researching one for my own startup, one I came across is http://www.patentinsurance.com/ .

I don't know much about them except what's on their website, so do not endorse them, except to say that I would like to enroll my company in either their service, or a similar one soon.

The offering I am most interested in is what they call "IP Defense Insurance". Basically, in the event a troll attacks, this provides a war chest for my court defense costs.

(And hopefully, gives me a chance to maul those punks in court so hard, they regret ever looking our way.)

sparknlaunch12• 14 years ago

Eeek, good article. This is something government needs to step in and help with. However curious of the patent troll letters to ignore and not ignore?

For example, if you don't pay your mortgage and ignore letters from the bank, you eventually lose your home. So you would legally need to respond to some solicitation, no matter how trivial.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

It depends on the action. If we had been immediately sued then, yes, we would have had to respond. But often patent trolls will contact you first threatening to sue in an attempt to get a settlement. This isn't a legal motion filed in the courts, so you aren't required by law to respond.

leadola• 14 years ago

Wow! That's scary, and I'm super impressed by your wife's approach. I have been the subject of 2 nuisance lawsuits. I won both. But I don't think I'd have your guts.

spiredigital8• 14 years ago

It was / is scary! Luckily, I had a wife familiar with the court system. Plus, she's a rock star to boot. ;-)

Were the two lawsuits you faced patent related? Or something else?

My Encounter With a Patent Troll

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