When Armor Met Lips

I just looked up the authors of the article from their links at https://www.researchgate.net/publication/363885520_Seals_wha... and none mentions geology, though they did mention paleobiology, paleontology and fossils.

What did I miss?

angiosperm3• 2 years ago

Paleontology used to be a subspecialty of geology, for a long time after they proved fossils had once been animals. Which the geologists had to do.

mannykannot• 2 years ago

"Pinnipeds evolved about thirty million years ago. They showed up first in the colder parts of the northern hemisphere, then in the Antarctic, then in temperate zones."

That's an interesting sequence, given that the continents then were about where they are now.

ricardobeat2• 2 years ago

Maybe they evolved in both places independently, or maybe it took a couple million years for a pod of seals to make the journey from north to south, and then start dominating the local ecosystem.

ivanbakel• 2 years ago

Wikipedia says pinnipeds are monophyletic, so there's only a single evolutionary branch they originated from.

The travel question is much more interesting. Napkin math puts the distance between the polar circles at 12500 miles, the max swim speed of a seal at 25mph, giving a travel time of ~3 weeks of nonstop swimming as the crow flies. How does that happen? What would a pod of Arctic seals have eaten along the way, and what would have compelled them to make the trip out of familiar territory? How and why did they cross the temperate equatorial seas with a load of blubber?

nateb2022• 2 years ago

It is possible that they fed on extremophiles which thrived in really cold regions and later evolved to feed on other food sources.

thriftwy• 2 years ago

It takes one volcanic winter for them to cross the oceans and emerge on the other side, without being fit for the warm waters.

aendruk• 2 years ago

That’s the sequence of notable populations; individuals did who knows what.

pfdietz• 2 years ago

"So, you’re saying the nautiloids did okay until the pinnipeds sealed their fate?"

Terr_• 2 years ago

I'm nautiloid to say more about their spiral into the depths.

jagged-chisel• 2 years ago

ಠ_ಠ

klipt• 2 years ago

Never trust a pinnipedophile.

B1FF_PSUVM• 2 years ago

Also: https://crookedtimber.org/2024/02/19/death-lonely-death/#com...

about Voyager 1, recently in the news

vitiral2• 2 years ago

I really enjoyed this article, but I was really disappointed. For some reason I thought it was going to evolve into a Lovecraftian epic of how the grand and horrifying civilization of the ancient cephalopods and their relatives was thwarted by another species, one who paved the way for our own ignorant and doomed civilization to thrive.

I kept this feeling until the very end [spoiler] even when it was revealed to be seals I held out hope they could be a Lovecraftian player in a grand epic saga.

csours• 2 years ago

who do you think is protecting us from the lovecraftian horrors?

vitiral2• 2 years ago

In general? Mostly ignorance. From cephalopods? I guess it's the seals

Muromec• 2 years ago

Paperclip counting bureaucrats of course

yencabulator• 2 years ago

You might enjoy knowing that the name of one of the oldest known gods in Finnish history, one with very Cthulhu-style looks, came to mean walrus: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iku-Turso_(creature)

JKCalhoun• 2 years ago

I wanted to go fossil hunting (and for ammonites in particular) after watching these guys just haul them out:

https://youtu.be/9XWhdPL58is

Affric2• 2 years ago

Great photo selection with the shifty looking seal (gotta love the whites of caniform eyes) and a nice little summary of the article.

One thing about zoology and animal morphology is that we all know how important feeding is for animals but only real nerds love the digestive tract. Transport, skin, and reproduction are far more glamorous; but the mammalian sense of smell and mouth parts gave us such an advantage in the tertiary period.

It’s interesting that this sort of feeding never arose in the sea. I wonder what the ancestors of the pinnipeds who first ventured back into water ate…

082349872349872• 2 years ago

If they're related to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mustelidae , probably just about any catchable animals?

Affric2• 2 years ago

Probably otter like to an extent. Would be interesting if the first thing they ventured into shallow seas for was ammonites though.

angiosperm3• 2 years ago

Do not neglect the Paper Nautilus, a kind of Mediterranean octopus.

https://www.sciencefriday.com/articles/the-seamstress-and-th...

https://www.themarginalian.org/2022/12/26/jeanne-villepreux-...

Jeanne Villepreux-Power invented marine biology, single-handed in the early 19th century.

She observed them repairing a hole in their shell by gluing on a found patch.

teruakohatu• 2 years ago

That is interesting. I looked it up on wikipedia and the Argonaut / Paper Nautilus "shell" is a thin walled eggcase and that males do not have. It does not provide protection.

angiosperm3• 2 years ago

Female argonauts have the shell their whole life long, and do not only construct it when they have eggs to put in it. We may reasonably assume that it has survival value even when there are no eggs. We know, for example, that they carry bubbles in it to tune their buoyancy.

readyplayernull• 2 years ago

If you’re inclined to be pedantic about the nautilus’ limbs and say that /actually/ they are “arms” and not “tentacles” because tentacles have suckers on them, then (a) congratulations on remembering that long-ago biology class, and (b) see Footnote 1, above.

Something tells me an arm is a mechanical limb composed of connected poles that turn at their joints. And a hose-like limb without suckers should have its own name. A foot is an "arm", a penis is something else.

nehal3m• 2 years ago

Hey, speak for yourself!

pineaux• 2 years ago

Penis is definitely something else because it contains (almost) no muscles, while your other examples do (contain muscles).

Karellen• 2 years ago

Also, tails

zem• 2 years ago

you don't need a new name, "tentacle" is fine and does not imply suckers. see hydra e.g.

jrflowers• 2 years ago

It is a shame that this is not about when Armour Meats perfected their hot dog formulation

alexey-salmin• 2 years ago

"Ah! Love! The only thing my armor can't withstand!"

a3w• 2 years ago

So the ideal tank buster is a carnivorous unicorn: penetrate that armor, then schlorp out the crew! Genetics will go too far, if we ever get these.

h2odragon• 2 years ago

That's why the graceful, horse shaped unicorns of classical times died out; and what we have now is the up-armored, heavyweight rhinoceros version.

Evolution is amazing innit.

throwway1203852• 2 years ago

A fascinating case of how gunpowder has shaped biology.

mec31• 2 years ago

Reminds me of one of my favorite Far Side cartoons https://www.reddit.com/r/TheFarSide/s/g5y9E0ZlmI

CoolGuySteve• 2 years ago

If you find this evolutionary history interesting then I can't recommend PBS Eons enough. It's a great youtube series on the subject: well researched, a dense but breezy pace, and the paleo art + fossil images help convey information without being overly dry.

Here's the one about this subject: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vQ55ToQeWI

When Armor Met Lips

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