The Most Incompetent TSA Story Yet?

http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/01/possibly_the_mo.html

by codergirl • 14 years ago

108 48 14 years ago

Anechoic• 14 years ago

Heh. A couple of years ago I tried to carry on a microphone stand (something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Stage-Stands-7701B-Tripod-Microphone/d... ). TSA freaked, ran it through the x-ray a couple of times, escorted me out of the security area and stood buy while I checked it, watch as it went through the baggage scanner, and then finally allowed me back through the security checkpoint.

This story shocks me not at all.

adanto6840• 14 years ago

And yet I've taken a Volcano [1] through TSA's "security" at least 5 times. The first time the TSA agent asked a bit about it and, basically, he said: "oh, it is like a fog machine?" to which I answered "Yes"....

From then on, it has been a "fog machine" as far as TSA was concerned... ;-)

Admittedly, and sadly, I haven't tried to fly with it within the last two years [and, at that time, I didn't worry about it a bit nor did I clean it obsessively, etc. - these days, though, I'm hesitant to even attempt flying with it]... =\

[1] = http://www.storz-bickel.com/vaporizer/volcano-vaporisation-s...

codergirl3• 14 years ago

I think we need a stufftheTSAconfiscated.tumblr.com.

I went through for a job interview and I had a cast on and a blow dryer and flat iron in my luggage. They swabbed my cast, and took the items and made me wait while they checked them out. I bet someone walked away that day with perfectly styled hair.

drivebyacct23• 14 years ago

Yeah, you have more balls than I do. I wouldn't be caught dead with a Volcano in any of my luggage let alone a carry-on. I'd ship it. Far too paranoid. Mix a little bit of authority with the drug-paranoia culture and there's no way.

ars2• 14 years ago

It is surprisingly difficult to figure out what a volcano IS from browsing the website.

Tons of pages of how to use it, and how nice it is, and not one single word about what in the world it's for!

jacques_chester5• 14 years ago

The TSA did them a bit of a favour, confiscating this stuff: http://www.alivewater.net/prod/owr.htm

shaggyfrog• 14 years ago

Wow, just look at the ad copy:

"The Vortex Water Revitalizer is based upon a revolutionary concept in water treatment. It performs far beyond what any filtration system, distiller or reverse osmosis system will ever do for you. It processes all the water in a direct way, leading it into a double spiral, which creates a powerfull vortex energy field.

This uses Mother Nature's own methods of generating energy within the water. One of the results is that water's self-cleaning ability is re-established and the water is being restructured on a molecular level. The Vortex Water Revitalizer will restore the health of your water. It will make the water alive and well again."

This kind of derp wouldn't get through an elementary-level science fair. Definitely a lesser-of-the-two-evils kind of situation, though.

jacques_chester5• 14 years ago

"The vortex energy created by a double spiral flowform, restores the natural energy in your water, using Nature's wisdom with a little help from quantum physics"

Yahtzee!

jonah4• 14 years ago

"Test the running water's temperature with and without the Water Revitalizer. Also test freezing and boiling temperatures." [1]

Wow, $498 is cheap to change fundamental laws. ;)

[1] http://www.alivewater.net/prod/owr.htm#waterlook

jacques_chester5• 14 years ago

I can't speak for the TSA, but here in Australia I am routinely "randomly selected" for bomb screening.

I have a terrible beard. I know it, my family knows it, my friends know it, people on who drive past on the bus know it. But it conceals the chinese phone directory beneath my jaw, so it stays.

But it definitely gets unkempt and quickly. If I forget to clean up before I fly, bam, I'm chosen for the bomb test. If I'm clean shaven or have trimmed that day, I sail through.

It's absolutely random, I'm assured. No bias whatsoever. When asked to show a random number generator the staff tend to get a bit grumpy. Appeals to the combinatorial unlikelihood of being chosen so many times in a row fall on dead ears.

Because my beard makes me look like a convert to Islam, I get bomb tested. It's as simple as that, in my opinion.

jedberg• 14 years ago

Right after 9/11, I got "randomly selected" just about every time. This was when they were still calling out the last names of the people who had been selected.

It was basically a roll call of Arabic sounding names with a few Jews thrown in for good measure (me) and then usually a Smith or a Jones to make it seem random.

kondro2• 14 years ago

I've watched them, they are random.

If they aren't screening someone, they choose the next person to walk out from the x-ray screening area.

If they are screening someone, then they are busy.

Given the fact that they probably screen 5-10% of people travelling, I think you've just gotten lucky.

beambot• 14 years ago

If they alter the screen times based on the incoming queue's composition, then it may not be so "random." (ie. "Oh, there's a scruffy bearded guy in line; hurry up and shoo this clean-shaven fellow right on through.")

stoney• 14 years ago

Not sure why this is downvoted. I think it's probably right.

I get randomly selected for the bomb test almost 100% of the time in Australia. I don't think there is anything about me that is being discriminated against (typical white male).

I think they just screen a high percentage of people. Also, I think the longer you hang around after the x-ray (repacking your bag, getting dressed, etc), the more likely they are to approach you.

kijin3• 14 years ago

When asked to show a random number generator the staff tend to get a bit grumpy.

Rest assured, you are being screened randomly. Here's a prototype of the random number generator that they use: http://xkcd.com/221/

ars2• 14 years ago

> the chinese phone directory beneath my jaw

What's a chinese phone directory? Besides the obvious, which wouldn't fit on your jaw :)

rdouble• 14 years ago

many chins

kemayo• 14 years ago

If it helps... I'm white, clean-shaven, travel with my wife and daughter... and every single time I enter the USA I get sent to that special room in the back for the extra-thorough scan of my paperwork. It's kind of a pain, but at least I'm probably on some stupid list rather than just being profiled.

Evgeny• 14 years ago

From the comments, made my entire week:

They were obviously homeopathic bombs. Security found no traces of explosives, which had been diluted to the point that it wasn't present - thus making the devices even more effective.

antics• 14 years ago

I've got one of those stories.

My parents live on the opposite side of the country. I flew to see them one Christmas and then flew back home. As I unpacked after the trip, I discovered that my huge hunting knife had accidentally been in my carry-on bag the whole time. I had carried it through both Salt Lake and Philadelphia International Airports. Literally no one bothered me about it.

Someone once told me that America is "fully prepared for the past" with regards to terrorism. This experience makes me wonder whether even that is really true. And indeed, when I read up on the actual security practices, I discovered that on an alarmingly frequent basis, it is not our security measures that foil terrorists, but their sheer ineptitude. The underwear bomber, the attempted Times Square guy, and a whole host of other idiots had the opportunity to seriously hurt people, and had they even a modicum of expertise, they would have succeeded. Our security forces may be able to take credit for stopping some of these events, but how many? These were incredibly simple strategies, and given that they still couldn't identify and neutralize the threat before it would have been too late, I can't imagine it's an astonishingly high number.

In spite of this I'm not worried about terrorism at all. If someone started a security-free airline, I would fly on it every single time I had the option. What does frighten me is that we spend so much money on this stuff. Why isn't the TSA held accountable by the government? (And if it is, why are they so bad at it?) Do we honestly know that increased spending in technology catches more terrorists? We are trying to identify very sparse features, and it is not at all obvious that this is the best way to catch them. On the other hand, the American government has eliminated (I'm told) 200 of Al-Quaeda's top leaders. This seems like a much more effective method for demolishing this behavior.

phreanix• 14 years ago

Same here . I'm a competitive shooter and I've travelled internationally with live ammo lost in my bag that I found after unpacking. Total facepalm moment. It wasn't much, 5-6 rounds but I'm sure enough to get me in heaps of trouble had it been found in my carry-on. Then, they finally did detect something I had forgotten in my backpack again, but it was just airgun pellets, basically little pieces of lead.

DanBC2• 14 years ago

5 year prison sentence in England, so go careful.

jonah4• 14 years ago

Yep, similar story - they flagged my messenger bag for the 1" of water in the bottom of my stainless steel water bottle and made me go back, empty it out, and run my bag through the x-ray machine again.

OK, fine. But while I was opening my bag to remove the water bottle, I noticed my 3" folding knife clipped to the front pocket with my pens, etc! I very quietly emptied the water, closed up my bag and ran it back through the x-ray. They were satisfied and I was on my way.

Needless to say, I breathed a huge sigh of relief. (And feeling bold, left the knife in my bag for the return trip. Again no problem.)

Edit: typos.

vacri2• 14 years ago

It's hard to say how many terrorist events security actually stops. Raising the bar reduces attempts, and who knows how many there otherwise would have been? It's similar to when police departments get more bodies pounding the pavements, as the mere presence of authority helps keep things in check.

Certainly there's a sweet spot and the TSA is on the far side of it, but it's not as simple as looking at a number.

tikhonj• 14 years ago

I think that would be more of an issue if terrorism was a spur-of-the-moment crime. Violence on the streets can be completely random (violent people getting angry for no appreciable reason) or without much premeditation (a mugger mugging whomever he sees). In these cases, a police presence would deter a lot of the crime.

A terrorist attack would have to be planned. Anything at all meaningful is going to require explosives: you won't be able to hijack or even severely damage a plane with a knife or even a gun these days. Anybody who goes out of their way, gets explosives and probably has special training isn't going to be stopped by a bunch of ineffectual bureaucrats in silly uniforms. Anybody else isn't going to be much more dangerous on a plane than on the ground, so added security would make little sense.

drivebyacct23• 14 years ago

The TSA let me board with a lighter and an aerosol form alcohol. Didn't realize until I'd landed that they'd let me board with materials for a small-scale flamethrower. I donated the lighter to a smoker I saw at the airport and checked the other in my additional luggage before my return flight.

kijin3• 14 years ago

Just out of curiosity, what's an aerosol form alcohol and what do you use it for?

chc• 14 years ago

I think it's called "hairspray".

dmix• 14 years ago

From my understanding you are allowed one lighter in your carry on. I had two one time and had to throw one out.

lwat• 14 years ago

What could you possibly do with 2 lighters that you could not do with one

DanBC2• 14 years ago

from the comments:

> I have a college degree. I graduated Phi Beta Kappa. I work as a substitute teacher, and I make about $8.25 per hour, have no benefits, and have to find alternative work in the summer.

$8.25 is £5.24; that's less than UK minimum wage which is £6.08 if you're over 21.

I have no idea why Americans accept this. Why are Americans allowing billions to be spent on security theatre while schools struggle for funding?

The Most Incompetent TSA Story Yet?

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