Ask HN: I would like some career insight

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33539887

by Ayouby • 4 years ago

3 16 4 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

Hey everyone, I am a fresh graduate from university at 24, living in Melbourne, Australia. I studied bachelor of Engineering, with a major of product design. Which tends to cause a lot of confusion, but it's essentially mechanical engineering and industrial design.

During my study, I worked at a company in the power industry for 2 years, where I got to invent and design new products- which is unheard of for an intern as they usually get grunt CAD work. Although I didn't enjoy working with the company because of how they did things, I genuinely enjoyed my job, and got to work with my hands, create new things, and solve complex problems. I eventually got distinguished at what I did (generating lots of income and patentable designs) and surpassed some much more experienced co-workers in terms of coming up with new designs.

But this is where the fun ends. Firstly, there aren't many product development jobs in Melbourne, and the ones that exist involve me moving out of the family home to the other side of the city resulting allocating a large portion of my salary to rent. Secondly, these jobs don't pay much. In that specific company I had coworkers with 7 years of experience earning around $90k. So when I look at software jobs, I can find positions that are much less demanding (in job requirements and effort during work) than in my line of work, earning significantly more.

I've always been into tech, I have a home server, know decent python, docker, linux etc. But I'm at a crossroads, should I look into machine learning/other jobs and hopefully enjoy the money? Or continue doing what I love (working on physical products)? I admit I'm naive and don't understand both spaces fully. I understand that money is not everything, but I want to be able to afford a house and live comfortably.

A side question: What tech jobs can I look into? I prefer higher level thinking and planning like strategy, rather than focused development

tantony2• 4 years ago

Have you looked at the space industry? Rocket Lab operates in your corner of the world.

Also, there are a few space startups in AU from what I understand.

Ayouby6• 4 years ago

Thank you, Rocket Lab doesn't have any opportunity in Australia.

andirk• 4 years ago

Then move. The world is your oyster.

Famous American actress said, "Best advice I can give an aspiring actor? Move to LA."

tantony2• 4 years ago

But Rocket Lab does do stuff in NZ (which is a lot closer than the US for example). I figured you were open to a move :).

Anyways, all the best.

themodelplumber• 4 years ago

A high level of personal interest generally trumps the earning differential, unless it's a work-week unsustainable interest/passion.

As an example of work-week unsustainable, if it's better as a weekend thing for you in practice, or you get angry after doing it / trying to do it all day long, that's more of a passion activity and generally risky as a money-maker for the work week.

Focusing your work on your interests should also provide you with suitable energy/bandwidth for developing a supporting financial plan that identifies--and this is important--the minimum you need to make to live the life you want to live, house and all. (This can also include a minimum growth rate for your total wealth including savings & investments)

If you are into higher-level thinking IMO you also owe it to yourself to get into the theory of whatever you're working on, and conduct some simple informational interviews with people in industry working groups and so on.

Just some thoughts / experiences, good luck with whatever you decide. Keep in mind there are also multiple types/levels of interest, including the meta-interest of trying out various careers and roles.

Source: Am an independent career coach

GianFabien• 4 years ago

Have you looked at design companies? Boost Design is an example (Sydney only I think). Products with embedded smarts might be a good fit for your skills and interests.

Ayouby6• 4 years ago

I have been into embedded smarts as of late, as It does encompass a lot of things I'm into, thank you. Do you have any tips about getting into that industry without much experience?

beckingz• 4 years ago

Good luck mate. Optimize about 60% for income and 40% for passion and satisfaction, including all work-life balance/commute effort. Money can buy you the time to work on things you give a shit about. In tension, if you give a shit about your work you need less time and money to do your passion in your spare time.

Ayouby6• 4 years ago

Well said, thank you. I find it difficult to work on things that don't yield direct benefit ($ or productivity/convenience). And if work is just a means to make money, I'll quickly grow apathetic and depressed.

Any advice on this?

diatone• 4 years ago

Hey mate, I have a similar background and broke into tech via mech eng. in Melbourne a few years ago. Slightly different path but ended up okay, currently working at Canva which you may have heard of. I got started working for a startup adjacent to the CAD space, and can give you some advice if you’re up to it. My email’s in my profile. Either way good luck!

danwee• 4 years ago

Secondly, these jobs don't pay much. In that specific company I had coworkers with 7 years of experience earning around $90k.

Curious, what's a good salary for a software engineer with 7 years of experience in Australia? I know that $90K is low for American standards, and high for European standards. No idea about Australia.

Ayouby6• 4 years ago

It honestly varies so much depending on what type of software engineer. For a regular full stack developer with 7+ years, they can be looking at around $110,000. But take this with a huge grain of salt, as I'm not qualified to answer this question.

You can search on indeed and seek, and it'll give you a more accurate estimate.

sin_nitins• 4 years ago

If you are an Australian citizen, you can explore the USA E3 work visa route which is only available to Australians. Via USA you can explore Canadian job market too while still sticking to your passion. There are lots of design and research opportunities within academia which need engineering background with software assisted expertise. Firms which build industrial design software are always looking for talented engineers like yourself.

Similarly, Australian citizens have easy working holiday visa options within Britain.

Even if you crave for coming back to Australia in future, your experience gained in international markets will place you above the competition.

Additionally, don't just confine yourself to just USA and Britain.. Must look at anywhere quality design jobs are available (Germany, Japan, Israel, China, India, Nordic countries, Russia... yes Russia is way ahead of the rest when it comes to Mathematics and applied engineering areas.. Don't go by the media hype, use your own rationalization).

My suggestion will be to stick to your core expertise which is mechanical design and anything which leverages your engineering degree. Almost all areas of modern businesses need software skills too. Your engineering background will be highly sought if you use that as your main asset plus hands on knowledge of design software.

Never stray away from your passion due to external world's influences. Software development ultimately is a tool serving core business use cases where domain expertise and core engineering knowledge are still highly valued. If you join as a Java or C++ developer in an unrelated software firm, you'd be treated as a normal developer. Joining a design firm as a mechanical design engineer with software skills will place you as an expert right from the beginning. That will give you an edge while negotiating your future salary.

Ayouby6• 4 years ago

My concern is what kind of jobs want a generalist in 2 things? Software development isnt my passion per say, primarily because I like to work on physical things.

michepriest• 4 years ago

This is a perfect Unstuck in 15 question. Unstuck in 15 is a framework to get clarity in 15 minutes with 3 questions.

The first question could be: What are all of the options available to you?

You have move and change careers. One might be working in a lucrative job and creating side projects. Another is exploring different industries and seeing what those job titles are. They could be something unfamiliar such as “intrapreneur”

The second question could be: What information is missing about your options? You’re doing a bit of this by asking about tech jobs.

I worked as an AI product manager. There’s tons of opportunities in AI. If you’re wanting more strategy work look into becoming a product manager (not to be confused with project manager). Although I suspect you’ll eventually go back to wanting to build. Strategy is mostly stakeholder communications and negotiation.

The third question is always nuanced and depends on the person and situation. In this case it might be along the lines of: What are all of the ways you can advance toward a career in product design despite the constraints?

There’s voluntary apprenticeship, making things and sharing your process on social media, creating lucrative Udemy courses on product design…

Ask HN: I would like some career insight

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