Astronauts with disabilities can apply to Europe's space agency for first time

https://www.cbc.ca/news/science/astronauts-physical-disabilities-esa-1.6013038

by barbazoo • 5 years ago

30 42 5 years ago

dahfizz2• 5 years ago

This feels a bit played up. They are allowing short people to apply to be astronauts; I wouldn't consider that championing inclusion and diversity.

jhgb2• 5 years ago

Gagarin did it before it was cool.

barbazoo• 5 years ago

I'd say we don't let the good be the enemy of the perfect. This is what the article said and at least include more people with disabilities than it did before, isn't that good?

- They have a lower limb deficiency (for example, due to amputation or congenital limb deficiency).

- They have a leg length difference.

- They are of short stature (<130 cm).

anthony_romeo8• 5 years ago

You ignored the first bullet of the three, which was: "They have a lower limb deficiency (for example, due to amputation or congenital limb deficiency)"

jhgb2• 5 years ago

Technically, those are short people, too.

kingsuper202• 5 years ago

You could argue that an optimum space-human has amputated legs.

gostsamo• 5 years ago

I'm blind and though a big cosmos fan, I know that I'm not fit for the job and would not expect to be included. However, this might not be true for people with other disabilities and if they are fit for the job, it is pretty logical the requirements to be adjusted in order to allow them to participate.

standardUser• 5 years ago

In terms of novel space exploration, it would only make sense to compose a crew of smaller individuals who require less space, consume less food, produce less waste etc. There's a strong case to be made that a first time Mars mission, or similarly challenging feat, would be best undertaken by an all-female crew.

galgalesh• 5 years ago

My dream of going into space was shattered when I got the news that my heart was enlarged and I needed surgery to replace my aorta valve. Between the life-long dependence on blood thinners and the already-weakened heart, I don't think I'll ever be able to go.

systemvoltage• 5 years ago

Many people can’t become pilots (pre requisite) because of poor eye sight.

redis_mlc• 5 years ago

Well, the full story is ...

The vast majority of pilot applicants don't really need to be concerned with their vision:

- civil: will pass the vision requirements with correction to 20/20 near (the instrument panel) and far with glasses, contacts or surgery.

- US military: last time I checked, one service allows laser surgery, and the others are evaluating it.

I don't recommend eye surgery for civil pilots because of the risk of infection, sparkling, regulatory changes and changes in eye geometry in middle-age.

Note that DUIs and epilepsy are disqualifying, and heart problems usually make things difficult.

Source: pilot.

btkramer9• 5 years ago

Are you me? I've always wanted to go into space and I have the same heart condition. I found your blog where you posted about it further and I get the same migraines too lmao. I'll shoot you an email. Mine is my username at gmail. Cheers!

anthony_romeo8• 5 years ago

This is great forward-thinking. It's rarely too early to think about people with disabilities. Setting up some structure to allow reasonable accommodations early will help avoid a need to later 'open up' space travel to others when it [hopefully] becomes more commonplace. This sort of research ought to be done now while we're still in a nascent phase of space travel.

Disclaimer: I don't know much about the typical protocols of astronauts and the engineering required for safe space travel, but I do know a thing or two about disabilities.

mensetmanusman• 5 years ago

Reminds me of climbers and runner without real legs that can out perform the legged due to their use of carbon fiber.

https://www.wndu.com/content/news/Blade-runners-The-future-o...

the_lonely_road• 5 years ago

I’ve always wondered if NASAs obsession with “perfect astronauts” really had enough merit to warrant itself. My personal conspiracy theory was it was more about not losing face to the USSR then it was any practical need.

mzkply• 5 years ago

Sure it does, and it has nothing to do with another country.

They will take 10 years teaching astronauts about everything from orbital dynamics to spacewalking to Siberian survival.

It's literally millions of dollars spent on one person, so you need to maximize the probability of success. It's why they go for perfectly healthy people, both physically and mentally. Can't have someone quickly out of breath, or someone who breaks down in a stressful situation.

ksdale• 5 years ago

I always thought of it as a tolerances thing. The stronger/fitter (for certain definitions of those words), and the smarter (ditto), the more slack you have built into the system. On the average space flight, an average person is just fine, but when things go sideways, it's better to have someone with very exceptional abilities. That's also not to say that seeking "perfect" astronauts selects for the most ideal abilities, but that was my thinking about what they were going for.

caturopath• 5 years ago

Given the large number of people wanting the job and the low number of positions, pruning it in even a tiny-merit way seems like a nice strategy to employ. It's not like you're cutting anyone who could be predicted to be a gamechanger; there's only so much utility you can get out of an astronaut, I think.

philwelch• 5 years ago

The Atomic Rockets website (which is a great resource in general) has an interesting section about disabled astronauts: http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/crew.php#id--Cr...?

wintorez• 5 years ago

Some forms of disability could be useful in the context of space exploration. For example, using colostomy bags could make longer spacewalks possible and also remove space toilets altogether.

_u1dn2• 5 years ago

Space exploration seems difficult and delayed enough without this virtue signaling. Supporting disabilities would add a number of new challenges on top of the existing ones, and with marginal practical benefit (increasing the pool of potential astronauts by the small minority that have disabilities).

Being an astronaut is a ridiculously selective process, it’s not like disabled people are missing out on something here that’s accessible to any non-disabled person. The opportunity for someone to get into space, whether disabled or not, is almost nil regardless.

anthony_romeo8• 5 years ago

This is a bad take and arbitrarily discriminatory, and I don't like this sort of reactionary anti-virtue signalling I've been seeing a lot on HN recently. You did not establish that the "new challenges" are especially difficult to overcome, nor that they're not worth undertaking. There can be a lot to learn through this process, and that by itself is valuable. YOU seem to believe that there is only marginal practical benefit, but I can't quite understand why you believe that merely increasing the pool of applicants is a bad idea [and the European Space Agency seems to disagree with you as well]. I'm curious on the specifics of your interpretation.

It might be a "ridiculously selective process," but the specific restrictions within that process are, to some degree, arbitrary. They're certainly worth reconsidering and expanding from time-to-time as technology/safety improves, especially since we're getting closer to an age of commercial space flight where people with disabilities will have more access to space flight regardless of what any specific space agency will do.

_u1dn2• 5 years ago

I didn’t say that increasing the pool was a bad idea. In fact, I said it’s a benefit, albeit a marginal one because it’s a relatively small % of people we’re talking about here. The problem is that it comes at a cost. Furthermore, while we’re on the subject of pool increase, it’s also vastly lowering the selection pool if they favor people from this small group.

There may be aspects of the selection process that are arbitrary, but not having physical disabilities isn’t one of them. As the article discusses, this would involve changing a number of aspects about the program to accommodate this one specific group. It’s not just a matter of “reconsidering and expanding” the restrictions, it’s clearly a major undertaking.

me_me_me3• 5 years ago

My first gut reaction to this initiative is a bit negative. There are handful astronauts in the world for a reason. It is probably the most challenging environment where you need to be at your peak both mentally and physically.

I am all for inclusion but as article states only 550 people or so went into space. That's an insanely low number. For comparison world wide on average there are 3000 deaths due to car crashes A DAY. Everyday 6x time people die that went into space ever.

I hope this program will not push out people that are a safer option for an astronaut in favour of a PR stunt. And that we are not wasting money on enabling someone's apex dream.

I will never play in NBA no matter how hard I will study and train I am too short. Its life.

And I am not campaining to have a a single player per team below 5ft because life is unfair.

CountDrewku3• 5 years ago

I can't quite understand why you believe that merely increasing the pool of applicants is a bad idea

That's not the argument. The argument is barrier of entry is lowered to allow these individuals a chance. It's the same argument with the U.S. military and they have in fact lowered their standards to allow women into roles they couldn't get into before.

Now, if they don't change the barrier of entry and keep the same standards for disabled individuals I guess your take makes sense. However, if that's the case then you're going to have to admit it IS virtue signaling since they'd actually be changing nothing. You've put yourself in a catch-22.

hirundo• 5 years ago

For an astronaut could having legs be a relative disability? It seems to me that ableism is a very good thing with respect to choosing astronauts, but different in micro- than in macro-gravity. A disabled earthling could make an unusually able spaceling.

Astronauts with disabilities can apply to Europe's space agency for first time

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