Beijing Takes Aim at Prague After ‘One-China’ Dispute Deepens

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-10-09/beijing-takes-aim-at-prague-after-one-china-dispute-deepens

by ktln2 • 7 years ago

148 90 7 years ago

bloomberg.com

martythemaniak• 7 years ago

Well, that's one way to deal with overtourism.

mrbonner• 7 years ago

Man, I know what you mean!

eastendguy• 7 years ago

Prague had its own version of the Tiananmen square protests in 1968, when the Soviet Union and other members of the Warsaw Pact invaded the country to suppress the reforms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague_Spring

SubiculumCode• 7 years ago

Beijing is slow to realize that trying to strong-arm the West's views on Tibet, Hong Kong, etc will not work, and in fact, makes their international position weaker.

toxik• 7 years ago

I guess they’d need Wikipedia and the early Internet culture to know about the Streisand effect.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect

flukus• 7 years ago

You'd think Winnie the Poo would know this by now.

melling• 7 years ago

China is either the world’s 1st or 2nd largest economy, depending on how you measure it:

https://www.thebalance.com/world-s-largest-economy-3306044

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/mapped-worlds-largest-expor...

I think people are slow to realize their new position in the world.

When US and Europe shipped all that manufacturing to China, it created this problem.

FussyZeus• 7 years ago

We can manufacture elsewhere, and many companies already are. China needs us a hell of a lot more than we need China.

SllX• 7 years ago

Most of China’s exports are low value manufactured goods which can be made elsewhere. There’s a lot more countries in the world than there are Chinas, even if your worldview counts both of them.

gridlockd4• 7 years ago

China is either the world’s 1st or 2nd largest economy, depending on how you measure it

So what? Its exports account for only ~13%. According to the same data, Belgium is 2.4%. I've never even heard of anything "Made in Belgium".

secraetomani• 7 years ago

Xi doesn't care, just like Putin doesn't care.

liuliu4• 7 years ago

What's the end-goal?

Tibet cannot be a separate country (or in that respect, Hong Kong) very much like Quebec cannot be a separate country from Canada.

You can say that China becomes arrogant, but what exactly West expect other than a total war that rewrite much of the world nation borders?

---

Although way passed the point to convince anyone, my comment above and below conditioned on "after WW2 (breaking up any large geographical country is unlikely)".

nrp• 7 years ago

Quebec is not the best example. There have been two referendums on this, the second of which was extremely close to passing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_sovereignty_movement

The Supreme Court of Canada went on to confirm that a referendum is a legal method for Quebec to initiate secession: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reference_Re_Secession_of_Queb...

eschaton2• 7 years ago

Sure it can. Especially since Tibet is a separate country; invasion is no longer recognized as a way for a country to increase its area.

oska2• 7 years ago

Obviously Tibet can be a separate country (and was very recently).

And if Singapore is viable as a separate country, why not Hong Kong too?

Chinese empires have broken up many times in the past. I don't expect the fate of this current empire will be any different.

AnimalMuppet• 7 years ago

Why can't it? It once was, why can't it be again? Especially if the people of Tibet want it to be.

[Edit: oska beat me to it, and said it better besides.]

guardiangod• 7 years ago

Beijing doesn't care. Beijing only cares about 1 thing- internal unity. What better way to promote this than to show the strength of modern China.

China wants other countries to fear China's economic and military power, and to bow down to China's demand (or, at the very least, fearful of repercussions from China.)

I suspect that China is perfectly content with not interacting with other countries ever, as long as other countries recognizes China as the most powerful country in the world.

PS. Do you know China's netizens most popular nickname for USA? "America Empire"

vertex-four• 7 years ago

I mean, that's a pretty common opinion of the US pretty much everywhere.

chronic71819• 7 years ago

Good for Prague. We need more European countries/cities standing up to China.

Markoff3• 7 years ago

it's not country, heck not even city, it's just new Prague mayor one year in office without experiences who did pretty much nothing first year and he is confused thinking he is minister of foreign affairs instead of solving daily issues of inhabitants of Prague like main square flooded with drug dealers, illegal old car replicas driving all around city center, electric scooters illegally driving on sidewalks... not I guess resolving these things would not praise his ego in media

calculuscrayon2• 7 years ago

Why does China care about municipal politics of a foreign city?

On the other hand, I can't sympathise with the Tibet supporters either. The issue is not as straightforward as many Westerners believe[1].

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2009/feb/10/tibet-...

gridlockd4• 7 years ago

What does the feudal past of Tibet have to do with anything? Are the "Free Tibet" people covertly arguing for a return to feudalism?

alwaysdoit• 7 years ago

It's like a weird Chinese version of the White Man's Burden. They were "uncivilized" once upon a time, so now they deserve occupation.

infamia2• 7 years ago

The article you linked to is poor mostly because it's liberally bathed in whataboutism. Tibet's backwardness has nothing to do nor does it justify China's actions in Tibet. Two wrongs don't make a right.

calculuscrayon2• 7 years ago

Let's do a quick bias check: do you believe most Tibetans would secede given the vote?

I don't think they would, but neither do I know the statistic. If anyone can provide it (I couldn't), then if they would indeed vote to secede, I'll change my mind.

Markoff3• 7 years ago

by this metric Taiwan must be third world country, they had same starting position after WW2 as China and look how they made it without glorious CCP...

same goes for Tibet, you think without China they would stay in same place? it's like those people from post communists countries feeling nostalgia about communists and what everything they built forgetting what was built in non Communist countries, you know life goes on with it without Communist party, without usually goes better

JumpCrisscross2• 7 years ago

It feels like Hong Kong has spurred a political crisis in Beijing. Publicly denouncing the NBA? Publicly going after a European capital?

It would be one thing to do this behind closed doors. But the hamhandedness of it all resembles flailing more than a coherent strategy.

Is there a domestic nationalistic PR strategy this is playing into?

mc32• 7 years ago

It’s looking like geopolitical whackamole.

Probably due to inexperience with dissent since just about everyone capitulated after MFN was made permanent via WTO, whereas with MFN that had to be renewed annually and gave opponents a window to offer counter opinions.

microcolonel2• 7 years ago

Is there a domestic nationalistic PR strategy this is playing into?

Yes.

NeedMoreTea• 7 years ago

It does seem remarkably clumsy, but they seem to have completely boxed themselves in with Hong Kong from an international perspective. Maybe too many years of actions coming without much global consequence.

Havel flew the Tibetan flag for years and was a friend of the Dalai Lama, so I am glad to read that the Tibetan Flag is flying in Prague once again.

For anyone who doesn't know it, the Tibetan flag is one of the more striking world flags.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Tibet

boomboomsubban2• 7 years ago

Publicly going after a European capital?

A Facebook post from someone on the Embassy staff.

Publicly denouncing the NBA?

From what I've seen, an article in a state run paper.

The embassy event is strange, but I'm pretty sure they routinely publish similar articles in their paper.

I think something is causing the Western media to cover the recent cases in detail, and they write the articles to imply the message came from Chinese leaders.

JumpCrisscross2• 7 years ago

From what I've seen, an article in a state run paper

Plus "a statement published on [CCTV Sports'] Sina Weibo account on Tuesday" and the cancellation of NBA's China Games' broadcast [1].

Later, "Geng Shuang, a spokesman for its Foreign Ministry...said in a regular news briefing Tuesday that the NBA 'knows clearly what to say and what to do'" [2].

Spinning this as not coming from Xi's administration is absurd.

[1] https://www.scmp.com/sport/basketball/article/3031997/cctv-p...

[2] https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-has-an-apology-playbook-t...

Rebelgecko2• 7 years ago

I was in Prague a week or so ago and was surprised by how much graffiti there was regarding the politics Hong Kong/Taiwan/One China/etc. About a 60/40 mix of English and Chinese. Given the massive number of Chinese tourists I suppose it's a decent way to reach an audience in the touristy areas

lousken• 7 years ago

in which part of Prague have you been?

Rebelgecko2• 7 years ago

Praha 1 & Praha 6

User232• 7 years ago

It helps to know about the resurgence in Tianxia[1] ideology in China. It's vaguely analogous to the old American concept of Manifest Destiny, but with, of course, a much longer history and far greater scope. What it basically comes down to is that in the pre-Westphalian era the Chinese world view was that China had sovereignty over everything under heaven. The Great Game dealt that world view a pretty harsh blow, but the Chinese people persevered and through industry and shrewdness have restored themselves to something like their historical standing. I don't expect them to stop here. Influence is almost as much of a drug as power, and testing it is self-reinforcing. Look at how China is making the NBA their whipping boy for another example.

[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tianxia

ycombonator2• 7 years ago

TIL about Tianxia. Thanks

ta9413• 7 years ago

Not so sure the modern Chinese generally still clings to that.. probably more 自强 than 天下 (Tianxia)

For the past 50 years the global cultural viewpoint is largely Western (used loosely here)... it would be not practical to think that will always be the case, or has been the case for much of human history.

Using an easy to digest example of "individual freedom and unbridled freedom of expression" vs "know your place and be humble in your speech and actions"... <do your own thought scenario analysis>

...

The middle is very quiet... are they forced to be so? It's almost like two rival gangs fighting and a couple of old folks stepping in to try to restore peace. Both gangs will slaughter the old folks and then carry on fighting.

throw0101a• 7 years ago

And where could an English-speaking Westerner learn more about "自强"?

dvfjsdhgfv• 7 years ago

For an accessible and convincing (albeit controversial) presentation of this concept, see the movie Hero:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero_(2002_film)

Gustomaximus• 7 years ago

I'm surprised that business is so keen on China. Obviously they are a massive market, but they are also so fickle and nationalistic. Its so easy for a non-Chinese business to make an innocent mistake or just different view and have the government or citizens actively boycott you. I'd be hesitant to put any business reliance or investment in China these days.

philipov2• 7 years ago

My interpretation: the difficulty that competitors have penetrating the market means the profits will be that much bigger for the company that finally "cracks the code." It's like dopamine-seeking behavior writ large; the more you're denied payoff, the greater the anticipation, the more desperately you want it.

bcrosby95• 7 years ago

A month ago people probably would have said the NBA cracked the code. But I would hope that recent events had made it clear: there is no such thing as "cracking the code". It's a perpetual dance and if you trip once you're out.

mcguire2• 7 years ago

But Kickstarter lives off of Chinese factories.... :-)

devicetray0• 7 years ago

Since Beijing [was] a sister city of Prague, this got me interested and discovered that Dallas is a sister city of Taipei, Taiwan. Hmm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas#Sister_cities

microcolonel2• 7 years ago

Taipei has been a sister city of Houston since '61.

Taipei has a very large family. :- )

throwaway66920• 7 years ago

China’s embassy reacted angrily, saying on Facebook that Prague’s leadership should change its attitude as soon as possible or “it will be their own interests that will be hurt.”

That’s pretty pathetic. Honestly this sounds like a desperate Chinese government worker who is trying to save face

ycombonator2• 7 years ago

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/chinese-state-runs-out...

yumraj• 7 years ago

Wow, a city leadership has more balls than most countries combined.

Respect!!!!!!!

umeshunni2• 7 years ago

City leaderships have nothing to lose and can virtue signal all they want.

xwdv2• 7 years ago

What happens if all the western world stands up to China?

datapunk• 7 years ago

Mass of tariffs.

Sanctions on travel of key foreign citizens

To the extreme, nationalization of foreign owned assets

Economic disaster assuredly.

mikelyons2• 7 years ago

Is a China + Russia vs. "the west" WWIII off the table? (as a possibility, not a suggestion)

xwdv2• 7 years ago

I don’t see much of the point of WWIII. What assets would they be looking to take by military force from western nations? Oil fields? Cities? Seems like this is more of an economic war. Even if you could invade the US mainland for instance, what’s the point? More land, more problems, plus everybody has a gun.

Markoff3• 7 years ago

oh no, what are we gonna do, we will miss all those nice Chinese tourists completely ignoring they are in different country and they will cut financing to some football club? horror, dunno what will my children eat after they will do that...

Beijing Takes Aim at Prague After ‘One-China’ Dispute Deepens

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