Ask HN: How would you quantify the level of stress at work?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13482245

by bsvalley • 9 years ago

31 66 9 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

Are you stressed at work? How would you quantify the level of stress from %0 to %100?

Take the average of a typical week at work.

byoung23• 9 years ago

0%...I work remote and make my own schedule. I'm on my way to the airport for a month long vacation. As a contractor I can take a month off without needing approval from anyone. I can take a Tuesday off and go to Disneyland with my daughter without needing to lie about being sick.

throwaway2016a• 9 years ago

I can take a Tuesday off and go to Disneyland with my daughter without needing to lie about being sick.

Unless you are talking "on a whim" with no notice it would have to be a pretty terrible employer to not let you take a Tuesday off.

I'd be inclined as long as you give a week or two notice to approve that time off no problem. However, if you lied and said you were sick there is a major trust issue there and there would probably be disciplinary action

foliveira• 9 years ago

Unless you are talking "on a whim" with no notice it would have to be a pretty terrible employer to not let you take a Tuesday off.

I think OP was referring to not having to worry about the number of days he has taken so far, since he says "make my own schedule", i.e.: not having to worry about limits, either temporal or financial.

OJFord• 9 years ago

I'm not sure how this can be well-answered.

Any time you actually feel stressed, you're unlikely to feel that it's 'less stress' than some previous experience; I think it inherently feels each time like you're discovering what '100%' might be, or perhaps it's less than that - a thought that in itself only adds to the stress.

lowmagnet• 9 years ago

I'd say you don't since stress is a subjective and qualitative thing.

magic_beans• 9 years ago

Before I quit, I felt like I'd hit 100% stress at work. It was an unfriendly environment, my manager was so stressed that she stressed everyone else out just from talking to her, and I got a strong feeling that my project manager hated her job (and me). The work itself was tedious and poorly spec'ed out by the requestors.

100% stress can be FINE under the right circumstances. With a supportive boss and team, you feel like you won't actually drown in the work. But when the team is wishy-washy and distant... well, then you get a situation where something has to give.

treehau53• 9 years ago

I feel 100% stress because of the noise and distractions. It is 100% beacuse

a. I hate it so fucking much that I rarely even curse and it is making me want to say I hate it so fucking much

b. I am more sensitive to distractions and noise. I can't simply "put on headphones" like everyone always retorts when I say I can't focus.

c. There's absolutely nothing I can do about it. I can change jobs, but this stupid fucking fad has permeated everywhere. I have heard of exactly two companies that give their thought-workers distraction, noise-free environments. If I haven't put down roots already, maybe I would have given it a crack, but moving is not an option.

macobo• 9 years ago

Remote work is an option. :)

vintageseltzer• 9 years ago

Have you considered working remotely? There are a lot more remote positions available these days than you may think.

pasbesoin• 9 years ago

Just be very, very careful of your home environment. I ended up with neighbors from hell, while caught in a mortgage. Working from home was not an option (yes, they were that bad).

So, in the larger context, TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF, FIRST. BEFORE you work on your work environment, make sure your home environment is safe and restorative. (And, these days, has a fast enough connection.)

All else will come from this. Remote work. Or, when that's not possible, simple relief from stress when you are away from work.

TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF, FIRST.

artursapek2• 9 years ago

Agreeing with sibling comments here. Starting to work remotely has made me a lot more zen. And being in charge of my own schedule is a cherry on top.

treehau53• 9 years ago

I left out remote work. I do not consider it an option for many reasons:

1. I have tried it a couple times, and I did not do well. It's kind of like that advice where people say your bedroom should only be for two things: sleeping and sex, well home to me is only for home-y things: family, cooking, relaxing, house-chores. When I am at home, my mind is home. If I had the luxury of affording a bigger house with a separate office that feels detached from the rest of the house, I think it could work, unfortunately I won't know.

2. I am a little traditionalist in my thinking that having a presence in the office can only help you, and only being a remote worker can only hurt you. When it comes to job cuts for example, I think the people that are there day in and day out and have curated relationships with people are more likely to stay - it's human nature right? Also, getting a raise usually comes down to office politics. If you aren't there to understand how things work, it's going to be very difficult. Software engineers have pretty great starting salaries, but as we all know, they seem to get hard capped, depending on your market around the 150k to 200k mark. To be a 250k engineer must mean you are truly remarkable, something I am comfortable with admitting I am not.

3. To kind of restate #1, the separate of work and home is important to me. When I tried working remote, I always never felt that crossover from being home to being at work. Some people suggested that I actually get ready like I was driving to an office, and go out for a 15 minute drive to maybe a coffee shop or something to start my day, and if I ever get another chance at remote work, I may give that a shot.

I think as remote work becomes more pervasive, some of these issues I face may be solved, but I don't think we are there yet.

robin__• 9 years ago

Absolutely this! I do my main work one hour before everyone else in the office. The rest of the day i'm just trying to focus, while everyone else keeps talking, chatting, phoning or commenting their current task to themselves.

zild3d2• 9 years ago

No offense, but 100% stress would mean it is not possible to feel any more stressed. To me, it brings to mind an ER surgeon or fighter pilot. Lives are on the line.

100% should be a breaking point. It sounds like you've accepted your situation if you've only found 2 companies that have quiet work spaces, and if moving isn't an option. Are you going to spend your working life at this job, redlining it at 100%?

ddorian43• 9 years ago

.. why don't you complain dude ? what's the worst that can happen ? hell, ask everyone so you can form a group-complain or something ? fuck it complain everyday, making them stressed that you complain ? shit like, please lower a little the volume or stay a little quitter ? do it persistently and stress them back? fucking take a note from a doctor ? go around the office with noise detector to find the quietest desk and ask to transfer there? report anonymously for bad working conditions ? put cameras with movement detectors and keep stats on each desk ? but at least you'll find some closure instead of going insane

source: experience

treehau53• 9 years ago

I bring it up to managers and co-workers as often as I can, without sounding too bitchy or out of place, because I know how fickle some humans can be, I don't want to be a constant source of negativity -- you have to be in an exalted position to bring up these things, because otherwise you'll just be brushed aside -- well Frank over there sits in the noise and he's twice as productive as you -- well I am not Frank. That's part the reason I don't quit. I am hoping to excite some kind of change. There are enough psychological studies and evidence based claims I can make to fill a boardroom on the negative effects of distraction on productivity, it's just finding the right opportunity and having the right leverage.

austincheney• 9 years ago

I cannot speak to my current employer as my handle is not anonymized. I will say that in prior employments the level of stress was directly correlated to the incompetence of the staff and developers. Incompetent people tend to create two problems:

1. Job insecurity. Politics ramp up as employee mobility goes down.

2. The technology is trash. The internal tech is often riddled with excessive abstractions, confused organization, lack of purpose, and other unnecessary qualities that generally slows people down. Its a real bummer when 10 minute task takes 2 weeks to complete in the office.

I can only speak to large software companies and unfortunately the demand for employees will often exceed the available supply of confident AND experienced developers available in the market.

shawabawa3• 9 years ago

I've found I can quantify my overall stress level quite well by the length of my fingernails. The more stressed I am the shorter they get (through subconscious biting/chewing on them)

dogmata• 9 years ago

Surly the question is not how much stress full stop, but how much undue stress?

Some jobs are just inherently stressful, an Account Manager under pressure to get orders/sales over the line at year end, a Support Manager working with irate customers and escalating issues etc etc.

I've seen people go off sick with 'stress' and have staged re-introduction to the workplace, but if the role is inherently stressful maybe they weren't cut out for it in the 1st place.

On the other hand undue levels of stress can be placed upon employees by bad management (usually to try and save their necks after they've messed up in someway), and sometimes people put themselves under pressure by holding themselves to high standards.

Separating the source goes along way to being able to manage it.

mcjiggerlog• 9 years ago

Stress is hard to quantify. I generally find if I am having fleeting negative thoughts about work flashing though my mind outside of work hours then I am stressed and need to do something about it.

When work is going well and is fairly stress-free then I will not spend a single second thinking about work outside of work.

ggregoire• 9 years ago

How would you quantify the level of stress from %0 to %100?

Reminds me when my employer asked me to rank my level of happiness at work.

I hesitated between 7 and 8, the other guys in my team answered from 5 to 9.

teekert8• 9 years ago

No stress. I work at a large healthcare company in the Netherlands, we do science, oncology. There are no real hard dead lines because stuff either works or it doesn't and is killed before it does (us scientists are known to keep trying for too long apparently). I get motivated when stuff gets hard and I get to learn new things. Currently I just had my second child and my project allows for me to work in public transport or at home easily (doing data science on our Linux cluster) making it easier to get to 8 hrs a day and still be at home to assist my wife (who was quite "damaged" during the delivery) as much as possible. This is important because I have an insane commute of 80 min. I like my job.

I work 90% meaning I have a day off every two weeks. Plus, in the Netherlands there is Parenting leave meaning you can have about 1000 hours of unpaid leave anytime you like during your kids first 4 years, of course this is to be discussed with the boss but in my case it is always possible (I do it when it does not interfere with important meetings, conferences, colloquiums etc.) This is on top of the usual 5 weeks paid vacation every dutch person has.

iandanforth• 9 years ago

Can I have your job please?

teekert8• 9 years ago

It's partly the job, partly the country I think. For example, I only get 2 days off (paid) when my daughter was born. My wife gets about 6 weeks. We complain it's unnatural for a woman to work while she should still properly breast feed and complain that I'm needed at home badly now. We look jealously to Finland where they get more than 100 days, even when you are self-employed and men get over 10 weeks off. All paid. Yeah, taxes I know but also, less stress.

kzisme6• 9 years ago

I was speaking to someone the other day who has recently retired, and it took him 25ish years of working at a large company to get 5 weeks of vacation time :/

I think many people should get vacation time more quickly, or it should be a standard of five weeks just like the Netherlands.

teekert8• 9 years ago

Many people also buy the additional 12 days (this is comparable to unpaid leave.) The collective working agreement of my company also allows for 3 months of unpaid (to be combine with max 6 weeks of paid) leave starting last year.

teekert8• 9 years ago

But they way, people still have stress here. But the way I read this comments, it's less than in the US and you can often work less of be less achieving, earn less but still be able to come by easily and loose the stress. Stress seems to be more implicit at any level in the US. We still have people burning out here though and occasionally there are departments that almost develop a japans "stay a work as long as the boss then drink together culture", somehow.

Work life balance is recognized as very important here and the correct way to deal with a too large workload is to go to your Project lead and ask him where your priorities should be if you can only finish one of 2 things. This was really hammered in during an application interview at ASML. I answered that I'd pull an all-nighter if required, they were very adamant about never putting myself in a situation that could lead to burn out, even temporarily. Perhaps I'm a bit in a "highly educated" bubble and truck driver have more stress? Although truck drivers can actually get fined when they don't take their obligatory breaks and stick to decent working hours.

iamben• 9 years ago

Honestly sometimes it's zero stress. I feel absolutely fine. But stress creeps up on me - and I know it's hitting a peak when I start to get alopecia holes in my beard. It's only then I realise what's going on and how I'm feeling. A bit like boiling a frog, I guess.

A physical manifestation is an ugly and unwelcome reminder to get on top of things.

clueless1234• 9 years ago

Long ago, after a life event, I decided to ban stress as an "illogical activity".

I've got so good at it, that sometimes I have to feign being stressed so the higher ups don't think I don't give a damn. (I do, I just don't consider work "life or death")

patothon• 9 years ago

This. The only moments I feel stressed now is when I have to stand in front of 200 people.

clueless1234• 9 years ago

Try picturing them all in their underwear ;)

tgb• 9 years ago

Can you elaborate? Do you avoid stressful situations or just not feel stressed by the kinds of situations that you used to encounter?

clueless1234• 9 years ago

As an example: Something that used to drive me bats was being asked to do something I clearly knew was wrong for the project/company. Before, I would fight hard to make my point. Now, I try to illustrate my point the best I can, then I just do as told. (I bill by the hour anyways)

On a previous project I actually told a non-technical owner: "What you are asking me to do is basically to hit your finger with a hammer.. That said, it is YOUR finger and YOUR hammer.. so say so and I will do" (it actually worked!)

TheOneTrueKyle• 9 years ago

Stress level is at 100% for sure.

In a giant corporation that is comfy and has 3 levels of middle management. I currently hate life and trying to find a new job.

Everyday I wake up to rejection letters reminding me that I can't find anything better. At least I can fall between the cracks sometimes at work, but ultimately it is will be spent on applying to new jobs.

Its getting harder to get out of the bed in the morning.

debt• 9 years ago

0% right now because I'm not working.

I get stressed out when I need to work because I need money. And then I get work and money and I stress because of the work so I stop for a bit.

It's a poorly choreographed dance between wanting money and not wanting to work.

sailfast• 9 years ago

If pressed to find some numbers, one might measure it using a few metrics:

1) Turnover percentage

2) Number of mandatory recurring meetings factor (divide top line by # of meetings?)

3) Strictness of "Core Hours" (meaning, does it cover the entire work day, or just part of it) Perhaps this is a percentage?

4) Leave policy (multiplier for good policies)

5) Work From Home policy multiplier (flexible? routine? abnormal?)

6) Hours worked per week

7) For Software add: Test Coverage %, Automated Deploy Apps divided by Total Apps %, Uptime %

8) Open Office penalty factor

9) Team Room # factor (number of rooms / number of teams)

kzisme6• 9 years ago

As you sort-of eluded to - it varies by week.

Most of the stress in my life is caused by commuting to and from work, or not relaxing after work (ie: Not going home right after work).

Job wise - It's fairly stress free probably around 25%.

The majority of that percentage is from waiting on other people or answers to questions, or things that I feel are out of my control. I enjoy the work I do, and it hardly feels like work (which is great), but I feel like I could be challenged more.

lormayna• 9 years ago

My level of stress at the moment is around 50%, just because I have resigned a couple of days ago.

In the last 3/4 months the level of stress was 100%: a lot of overtime, a lot of nightly works and on duty calls. Furthermore my manager is part-time (the only case in my whole careeer) and it's under big pressure; the company is in the middle of a big reorganization and there is a lot of politic wars.

tcgarvin• 9 years ago

I read this question as "How would one go about quantifying the level of stress at work?", which is what I was hoping I would read about after the click.

In a world where metrics are useful for everything, I feel like a time-series graph showing relative stress levels time would be really illuminating.

zild3d2• 9 years ago

My first thought as well, in the quantified self area. Plotting heart rate data, blood pressure, while working

hosh• 9 years ago

I thought the same too.

I suspect stress capacity is going to be different for each person, and that capacity might change or shift over time (as a result of physical health, emotional stability, etc.)

Another is that the level of stress (and its attendent tension held in the body) one might be aware of is dependent on how well trained your awareness is.

We could narrow down "stress" by measuring the levels of stress markers in the body, but I think that only gives part of the picture.

koolba2• 9 years ago

It oscillates as a square wave between 0% and 100% depending on what's on fire, what's due, and who I have to deal with.

There's significantly more 0%s than 100%s though. Probably close to 5:1.

jcadam• 9 years ago

I'm currently in my first 'non-programming' programmer role. I was hired to provide 'subject matter expertise' on software development issues and to help define requirements and design architecture.

Meetings, talking to folks, writing documentation, meetings, drawing diagrams in visio, and meetings is my life now.

It's stressful because

1.) I'm not coding (So, I literally have to whip out my laptop and code something every day to maintain my sanity)

2.) It's really hard to tell if I'm doing a good job or not (i.e., I don't know the rules of this new game).

The pay is good, but I really miss being able to code in solitude for hours at a time during the workday.

Also, I'm starting to get headaches, a lot. They used to be rare.

clueless1234• 9 years ago

Get a pet project in open source. Fast!

alistairSH• 9 years ago

50%. I have periodic stress - approaching major releases, major changes in staffing (up or down), but my day-to-day stress level isn't very high.

I also work a reasonable schedule, generally 40-45 hours/week, rarely more than that, and maybe 2-3 weekends in 15 years at my employer. Good vacation policy, flexible daily schedule, and a short commute as well.

anotheryou• 9 years ago

From the title I understood you meant "how to quantify stress in general". It's something so subjective and you can never know how whimpy or brave people are. I really like the idea of asking for what one would sacrifice for the discomfort to go away.

Would you move 2 workdays to the weekend so you can work in peace? Would you move to another town if there was a less stressfull job, all else equal?

freddyc• 9 years ago

I realize this doesn't necessarily answer the original question, but in my mind I view two major buckets of stress:

1. Immediate, demand-driven stress.

2. Low-level, semi-constant stress (the nagging kind).

I'm perfectly fine with 1, as I accept that as part of the job which I'm highly compensated for.

Number 2 though is what always affects me the most and is the reason I left my last role. It's the kind of stress that is alway present under the surface but never quite manifests itself like #1 does.

Think of the boss who is constantly inconsistent (consistently inconsistent?), saying something one day and then something completely different the next. You shrug it off with an eyeroll and start re-doing all of your work, but deep down it eats away at you. Or the lazy colleague who you're constantly cleaning up after but who is best buddies with leadership so is regularly promoted ahead of more capable colleagues. The frustration bubbles under the surface but due to office politics there's nothing you can really do about it. I could go on, but I'm sure we've all suffered some form of low level stress that has a far more significant impact on our personal well-being than we care to admit.

zwieback• 9 years ago

5% of hours in a typical work week. The occasional machine-down situation due to a bug I put in the software or a disagreement with a higher-level manager.

nunez• 9 years ago

Despite being in quite stressful situations at the moment (consulting with tight deadlines and unclear deliverables), I actually feel quite at ease. Team is great, client and location are great and my weekends are protected.

thescribe• 9 years ago

Extreme, the open office plan means I'm constantly interrupted no matter what I do.

apimenta• 9 years ago

Hi,

I'm working on a project called Performetric (https://performetric.net) that aims to help objectively measure levels of fatigue and stress and help manage some situations mentioned here. I am not doing my “pitch” here, but trying understand if a solution like our can help you

Ask HN: How would you quantify the level of stress at work?

Related Stories