Things They Don't Teach You in School

https://www.netmeister.org/blog/semper-ubi-sub-ubi.html

by shawndumas • 10 years ago

82 29 10 years ago

Radim3• 10 years ago

An impressive collection of tips!

Highly relevant plug: for students / fresh grads wishing to bridge the academia-industry gap, we offer a free Incubator programme [1]. There we mentor talented students from partner universities on such practical matters.

We do specialise in machine learning, but most of the tips here apply 100%. Surprisingly -- at least to many ML students coming from academia -- even (especially?) the "be boring" bit of advice. People can get so hyped up about the latest ML fads that they miss the forest for the trees, so to speak.

[1] http://rare-technologies.com/incubator/

8note2• 10 years ago

That looks pretty interesting; I might apply.

One question about the non-optional meetings: when are they? If I am in PST, will I have to skip sleep or work to attend?

Radim3• 10 years ago

Lev, our main community liaison, lives in London.

We've had students from all over the world though: from Brazil to Europe to India to Japan. So I wouldn't worry about this too much. If the will and the motivation is there, we'll find a time that makes everyone happy.

unabst4• 10 years ago

So I guess this was a comedy piece? Some more serious issues I've noticed:

#1. They don't teach you that teachers are paid to put up with you. Employers aren't paid to put up with you. They're paid to fire people who waste their time and interfere with the work that needs to get done.

#2. They don't teach you how to not waste people's time. Some of the group activities that force mingling are the worst. Most real work does not require communication, especially at entry level positions. Take instructions once, and just deliver what is being asked of you.

#3. They don't teach you what's being asked of you. Students show up at class, deliver homework and take exams, with the occasional project maybe. Work is all exams. It's about your constant output that is monetarily valued by your employer, which is always being examined. Homework and exams have no value. But the degree has value, right?

#4. They don't teach you the degree has little value.

The list can go much longer, but even if you're a Harvard PhD, until you get this, you're a fraud. And even if you're a high school dropout, if you get it, you're in business. Employers don't really care where you're from once you're in the building. They just need things to get done.

(The degree acquiring experience can be spectacular for you regardless of where you go actually, but degrees just aren't worth what they used to be, for sure.)

onion2k2• 10 years ago

That assumes some sort of weird universe where instructions are always perfect. I don't live in that universe. Every person who does paid work of any sort should be questioning their instructions, communicating with their colleagues about the instructions, and giving their manager feedback if the instructions are incomplete or if the situation changes. That applies to everyone from people writing complex software to people paid to literally just dig holes.

The notion that communication skills are universally important across all jobs is entirely true.

unabst4• 10 years ago

Communication skills are important, but you need to know when to shut the fuck up. That's what's universally important and entirely true.

Instructions are never perfect. It's whether you can get the job done anyway, once you know what is being asked of you, which is mostly a one time initiation. Ever see someone repeatedly asking and questioning what is being asked of them? That's someone who is going to struggle for the rest of their lives in every professional environment someone accidentally put them in.

Supervisors don't want to hear about imperfections that you could have worked around yourself. You aren't being paid to call and talk and yap. You're being paid to deliver. Your approach is academic already, and goes to prove my point. Instructions only need to meet you half way. In fact, less the more for you. This is why it's completely academically backwards. The more you get done with fewer instructions, the more valuable you are because you cost less time.

Imagine a Postal Worker questioning the features on their mobile device (which clearly suck). They're being paid to work with it, not question it and talk about it.

Communication skills are important, but communication itself is an absolute bottleneck in any workflow (with emphasis on flow). Minimize communication volume, and maximize communication value. Work is no excuse to talk.

But that doesn't mean all work is anti-academic. Most of it is though. The best academic jobs will always be in academia.

WalterBright3• 10 years ago

They don't teach you the degree has little value.

It's true you can get a degree, even an engineering degree, without learning much of any value. But if you go to college to actually get an education, the degree is simply a side effect.

If you avoid the hard classes, do as little as possible, etc., and get a degree but don't be surprised to find out that degree is worthless.

x1798DE2• 10 years ago

I think you have this exactly backward. Learning during college is a side effect. You are paying for the degree mostly as a costly signal. If you want to learn but don't care about a degree, there are much better and cheaper ways than going to college.

stevetrewick• 10 years ago

Most real work does not require communication

This made me roll my eyes. This may apply to whatever you are currently engaged in, I couldn't possibly say, but it is not at all typical. Take a look at [0] which lists occupation types from the US Bureau of Labor Statistics. Go have a look at the underlying data tables. Now, you can either choose to classify the majority of those as 'not real work' or you can concede that projecting outwards from where you are might not be a good way to reason about the world.

[0] http://www.careerinfonet.org/oview3.asp?id=&level=Overall&no...

Radim3• 10 years ago

I see there's some controversy here about your points (or perhaps just your way of presenting them?). I'd like to weigh to say your advice is solid.

Employees are absolutely valued by their boss based on how much hand-holding they require and how autonomous they are. In fact, in functional companies, that's what decides your factual seniority: Not the years your butt sat physically in some chair, but how little you need to get going and have results.

It's not controversial at all.

From students who need the instructions in almost algorithmic form and understand no context, to business owners who create their own opportunities and generate time for others, there's a whole spectrum.

zerooneinfinity• 10 years ago

Stop trying to be the smartest guy in the room and lighten up. Those are my tips.

c218807• 10 years ago

Black lives matter

So, how do we stop them from killing each other?

You're probably now going to tell me that cops are racist but copy in the USA are assholes no matter your race.

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2013/...

cantbecool• 10 years ago

Those statistics are eye opening. I wonder why they are never touched upon during the numerous debates during election season in the US.

ZeroGravitas• 10 years ago

I can think of several structural changes the US could make to their society if this was actually a priority for them.

The way you phrase the question it appears you can't think of any, even though you go on to immediately mention one from my list: dysfuntional cops.

Like the deaths, you seem fatalistic about changing policing, apparently asshole cops are just a fact of life to you rather than a result of broken institutions.

xiaopingguo• 10 years ago

Scandinavian languages already have "programmering" for "computering" if you want to sound quaint.

jonjonBoy• 10 years ago

Leave Donald Trump alone bro.

746F74752• 10 years ago

Who here is a feminist? (Two, three hands go up, timidly.)
Wait, let me ask another way around: who here thinks that all people, regardless of gender, have the same rights and should be treated equally? (All hands go up.)
Congratulations, you are all feminists.

It's too bad that current feminism/SJW movement has so corrupted the feminism "brand" that I do not feel comfortable identifying as one and probably who more hands don't get raised. The definition given doesn't match what currently feminism is about.

rubbsdecvik• 10 years ago

It's too bad that current feminism/SJW movement has so corrupted the feminism "brand"

I've started to think of the SJ movement as analogous to the GNU/GPL movement. From a high level, it's easy to see it as extreme and difficult to identify with, but if you give it some time and thought, you start to see the merits of the argument.

Note, one does not always have to agree to think there are merits. Once I saw SJ advocates in this light, it also became much easier to see that much like the software license debates, there are a spectrum of beliefs; Not all GNU advocates are alike, just like not all SJWs are alike.

The definition given doesn't match what currently feminism is about.

I have not seen evidence that this has changed. I have, however, seen opinions that I don't agree with, but ultimately stem from that working premise.

fit2rule2• 10 years ago

I think that all movements have to deal with the agent-provocateur problem, sooner or later - which is to say, any time you make an enemy, if you don't allow your enemy to become you properly, then you will become your enemy.

This is what happened with feminist movements: they became the very frothy-mouthed totalitarians they were resisting. Because they didn't do enough to deal with the totalitarians that were attracted to their platform of power, gained in the rising days of the feminist movement, and must now share that platform with a vast array of differing views, somehow aligned with feminism, but nevertheless diluting the goals of very subject and thwarting it in a direction not originally intended.

All movements have to deal with this factor, it seems. Its a social one.

746F74752• 10 years ago

I have not seen evidence that this has changed.

Just the things like: "men can't be opressed" and all the "check your privilege" shit just brings my piss to boil. And more I see all these SJWs acting like spoiled kids with their "safe zones" and "trigger warnings" more I feel like maybe things were better back in 40s and 50s.

Maybe it's a cultural thing, I really don't care, but when I'm told that I'm the very essence of evil-sexists-racist-pig because I'm male, white and straight (or cis, whatever that means) I can't but help feel like I'm being bullied for nothing I've done nor my Finnish ancestors.

fit2rule2• 10 years ago

I concur. I'm an equalist, not a feminist. I don't believe in either sex having more rights than the other, over any issue whatsoever, and think we should treat everyone - regardless of race, language-spoken, gender, culture, whatever - equally, no matter what.

I never use the word feminist because it just doesn't mean that any more. What it means, is something else entirely than what I've just described.

Things They Don't Teach You in School

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